Friday's Breakfast Debate - Signings/Villa

[1964white]

TC sent a message out yesterday to let Leeds fans know that we were not done in the transfer market

Defenders & a striker seem to be the priority signings we are looking to bring in before the season commences !
We are linked with Flint, Bryan both Bristol City players, also talk of a European international CB in the mix.

Many footy fans fancy for the championship are Aston Villa. So far they have signed :

36yo John Terry
33yo Glen Whelan
33yo Chris Samba
29yo Ahmed Elmohamady

Bruce seems to be relying on some golden oldies to get Villa up

So why are the Villa pensioners strongly fancied, surely not the way to go ?

[weasel]

Must admit Villa were very underwhelming last season. They threatened a bit after Bruce took over but it was very brief. As such I think they needed a big overhaul and it may take time for the new players to settle. John Terry is very unlikely going to be able to play in all 46 league matches as at his age he will be more prone to picking up minor knocks which won't heal in 2 or 3 days and as such it could lead to the having to change their backline constantly. I certainly wouldn't see them as automatic challengers and think they will do well to finish top 6.

Steve Bruce has gone down the Warnockian route with the oldie signings but how much motivation will those guys have when the going gets tough as they know they won't be kept on if they do get promoted. Does JT's CV really need a promotion with Villa on it?

I much prefer the route we have gone down by signing younger players with their careers ahead of them. Players that want to do well and want to play at a higher level. Sure some won't be able to fulfil their potential and some may not even have the right attitude/work ethic but you would hope that some will.

[1964white]

Must admit Villa were very underwhelming last season. They threatened a bit after Bruce took over but it was very brief. As such I think they needed a big overhaul and it may take time for the new players to settle. John Terry is very unlikely going to be able to play in all 46 league matches as at his age he will be more prone to picking up minor knocks which won't heal in 2 or 3 days and as such it could lead to the having to change their backline constantly. I certainly wouldn't see them as automatic challengers and think they will do well to finish top 6.

Steve Bruce has gone down the Warnockian route with the oldie signings but how much motivation will those guys have when the going gets tough as they know they won't be kept on if they do get promoted. Does JT's CV really need a promotion with Villa on it?

I much prefer the route we have gone down by signing younger players with their careers ahead of them. Players that want to do well and want to play at a higher level. Sure some won't be able to fulfil their potential and some may not even have the right attitude/work ethic but you would hope that some will.

Couldn't have written it better Weasel

If I lived in Hector's world I would reply with a 'Ditto'

If any of our relatively unknown signings crack it in the championship with the likelihood of increasing their selling value by £millions then our current scouting system would have to be acknowledged with much credit

[hector]

Must admit Villa were very underwhelming last season. They threatened a bit after Bruce took over but it was very brief. As such I think they needed a big overhaul and it may take time for the new players to settle. John Terry is very unlikely going to be able to play in all 46 league matches as at his age he will be more prone to picking up minor knocks which won't heal in 2 or 3 days and as such it could lead to the having to change their backline constantly. I certainly wouldn't see them as automatic challengers and think they will do well to finish top 6.

Steve Bruce has gone down the Warnockian route with the oldie signings but how much motivation will those guys have when the going gets tough as they know they won't be kept on if they do get promoted. Does JT's CV really need a promotion with Villa on it?

I much prefer the route we have gone down by signing younger players with their careers ahead of them. Players that want to do well and want to play at a higher level. Sure some won't be able to fulfil their potential and some may not even have the right attitude/work ethic but you would hope that some will.

Ditto




I hate to disappoint Leon....

[1964white]

Ditto

I hate to disappoint Leon....

Little things like that Hector make my day

[Ratscoot]

Ditto

Agree with that Ditto

[1964white]

Agree with that Ditto

You're both ditto mad

[weasel]

Couldn't have written it better Weasel

Don't sell yourself short - there was at least 1 typo

[Oscar]

Villa look very strong to me, they have quality all over the pitch:
Premier league quality full backs in DeLaet, Elmohamady and Neil Taylor
John Terry at centre back, I know he is 36 but Terry has never had any pace really or been in the slightest reliant on pace. Incredibly intelligent defender, he wouldn't have been a good signing for us because of his Chelsea career, however, for Villa a team with no real rivalry with Villa I have to say I think it's a great signing.
Midfield Options: Whelan, Jedinak, Hourihane and Lansbury
2 decent wingers at this level in Adomah and Grealish.
And 3 quality strikers at this level McCormack, Kodjia and Hogan

They can play any formation they want and injuries/suspensions really aren't going to affect them with the squad depth they have.

If you compare that to Leeds how many different systems can we play with the current squad?
Only really convinced in a 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 imo, very unconvinced we could play 3 at the back or 2 up front systems/formations with the current squad we have.

[1964white]

Villa look very strong to me, they have quality all over the pitch:
Premier league quality full backs in DeLaet, Elmohamady and Neil Taylor
John Terry at centre back, I know he is 36 but Terry has never had any pace really or been in the slightest reliant on pace. Incredibly intelligent defender, he wouldn't have been a good signing for us because of his Chelsea career, however, for Villa a team with no real rivalry with Villa I have to say I think it's a great signing.
Midfield Options: Whelan, Jedinak, Hourihane and Lansbury
2 decent wingers at this level in Adomah and Grealish.
And 3 quality strikers at this level McCormack, Kodjia and Hogan

They can play any formation they want and injuries/suspensions really aren't going to affect them with the squad depth they have.

If you compare that to Leeds how many different systems can we play with the current squad?
Only really convinced in a 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 imo, very unconvinced we could play 3 at the back or 2 up front systems/formations with the current squad we have.

Add Chris Samba to that lot & you have seven players 29yo or over

[hector]

will they all have to be subbed at half time coz they are knackered??

[1964white]

will they all have to be subbed at half time coz they are knackered??

Long old season is the championship unlike the prem where they play eight games less.
Also prem managers tend to rest players with their vast squads so some players are lucky to play 25 times a season or if you are ex-Leeds player you more likely to get more splinters in your bum than games

[Oscar]

Add Chris Samba to that lot & you have seven players 29yo or over

The Chris Samba signing is a very strange one Leon, last time he played in England for QPR in the premier league he was dreadful. I did think 6-7 years ago when Samba was playing for Blackburn he had enough ability to play for a Everton or Tottenham level of club, however, since he left Blackburn he hasn't looked anywhere near the same level of defender. However, the other 3: Terry, Whelan and Elmohamady are quality additions at this level imo. Whelan has been a key part in Stoke rising up the table over the last few years very underrated player imo, also think Elmohamady is a quality player.

Terry, Samba and Whelan etc probably won't play anywhere near 46 games, however, Villa have squad depth to cover this.
If Terry and Samba are tired they can play Tommy Elphick and James Chester who are decent players at this level.
If Whelan and Jedinak are tired they can play Henri Lansbury and Hourihane.

Our lack of squad depth in certain positions is evident with the fact that we have 2 weeks to find another centre back, otherwise we are going to be playing a right back (Ayling) and/or Cooper alongside Pennington at centre back. Are lack of quality and depth at centre back and in terms of forwards is a real concern imo.

[weasel]

Terry, Samba and Whelan etc probably won't play anywhere near 46 games, however, Villa have squad depth to cover this.
If Terry and Samba are tired they can play Tommy Elphick and James Chester who are decent players at this level.
If Whelan and Jedinak are tired they can play Henri Lansbury and Hourihane.

Our lack of squad depth in certain positions is evident with the fact that we have 2 weeks to find another centre back, otherwise we are going to be playing a right back (Ayling) and/or Cooper alongside Pennington at centre back. Are lack of quality and depth at centre back and in terms of forwards is a real concern imo.

The trouble they have though is that the likes of Elphick, Chester, Lansbury and Hourihane will all be thinking they should be starting, how happy are they going to be sat on the bench waiting for injuries/suspension/fatigue? If everyone stays fit then there will be a real problem for Bruce to keep everyone happy not to mention keeping everyone match fit too given who uncompetitive the U23 games seem to be.

Obviously it is a double-edged sword as lack of squad depth, like you highlight for us, can be a real problem too. Having players with the flexibility to play one or two matches, when needed, out of their natural position is in my opinion the best way to solve both the problems. We do seem to have edged towards that with players able to play several positions.

[1964white]

The Chris Samba signing is a very strange one Leon, last time he played in England for QPR in the premier league he was dreadful. I did think 6-7 years ago when Samba was playing for Blackburn he had enough ability to play for a Everton or Tottenham level of club, however, since he left Blackburn he hasn't looked anywhere near the same level of defender. However, the other 3: Terry, Whelan and Elmohamady are quality additions at this level imo. Whelan has been a key part in Stoke rising up the table over the last few years very underrated player imo, also think Elmohamady is a quality player.

Terry, Samba and Whelan etc probably won't play anywhere near 46 games, however, Villa have squad depth to cover this.
If Terry and Samba are tired they can play Tommy Elphick and James Chester who are decent players at this level.
If Whelan and Jedinak are tired they can play Henri Lansbury and Hourihane.

Our lack of squad depth in certain positions is evident with the fact that we have 2 weeks to find another centre back, otherwise we are going to be playing a right back (Ayling) and/or Cooper alongside Pennington at centre back. Are lack of quality and depth at centre back and in terms of forwards is a real concern imo.

Still to early to judge the Leeds squad as TC & his backroom staff are prioritising the defence right now & I thnk well see at least three or four more signings before the season commences

Leeds are building for the future with young talent whilst Villa are going down the Warnock route looking for a quick fix !

[Oscar]

Still to early to judge the Leeds squad as TC & his backroom staff are prioritising the defence right now & I thnk well see at least three or four more signings before the season commences

Leeds are building for the future with young talent whilst Villa are going down the Warnock route looking for a quick fix !

I am confident that this is the best squad we have had for years, however, I still think it needs 1-2 quality signings to really compete at the top of the table this season.
Think we have to prioritise quality over quantity now: centre back and a versatile forward forward/striker and I think we are really well placed to have an excellent season, think we are just a Bartley and McCormack away from having a top quality squad of players.