Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Martyn » Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:15 am

It does seem like we have gone back to the Hockaday style of pointless passing across the defence and midfield with no invention in terms of getting it forward. That brief spell under Redders was a mirage.
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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by 1964white » Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:30 pm

Guildford White wrote:It does seem like we have gone back to the Hockaday style of pointless passing across the defence and midfield with no invention in terms of getting it forward. That brief spell under Redders was a mirage.
Even though we were not good last night our style of was much different to that of Hockerday's, tbh we played the same way as Redfern did....the main difference was our final ball was poor on countless occasions, we were unlucky with a couple of passes, had they found their man we were completely through, credit to the Reading back 4 for their good defending. The likes of Huddersfield/Bolton/Bournemouth defenses were naive where as Reading were well-drilled & organised

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Gurj » Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:35 pm

I guess what we have to ask now is were we looking at the Redders spell with rose tinted specs ?

In other words did we really play that well in that period. Yes we picked up 10 points out of 12 and you cannot question the importance of that but stats can be deceptive.

Bolton - by all accounts we were extremely lucky to get a win that day ( warnock's goal was a shot we all know that ) and the performance itself was generally average at best.

Birmingham - We were awful for 60 mins, came good for 20 mins in second half but easily could have lost at the end when Blues put us under a lot of pressure including them not getting what looked like a pen.

Bournemouth - Let's face it, had Bournemouth not been so profligate in front of goal and Silvestri not been on fire, we could and perhaps should have been 3 or 4 down iby HT. No doubts the comeback in 2nd half was great but we were lucky not to be too far behind at that stage.

Huddersfield - I watched this game on live stream and whilst we played well, it has to be said that Hudds were pathetic that day. Did they make us look better than we were/are ?

I am not trying to be negative in the way I have viewed those games but to me there is some semblance of truth in thinking that we were considerably flattered by the results that Redders got during that spell.
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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by 1964white » Thu Oct 02, 2014 1:00 pm

Gurj wrote:I guess what we have to ask now is were we looking at the Redders spell with rose tinted specs ?

In other words did we really play that well in that period. Yes we picked up 10 points out of 12 and you cannot question the importance of that but stats can be deceptive.

Bolton - by all accounts we were extremely lucky to get a win that day ( warnock's goal was a shot we all know that ) and the performance itself was generally average at best.

Birmingham - We were awful for 60 mins, came good for 20 mins in second half but easily could have lost at the end when Blues put us under a lot of pressure including them not getting what looked like a pen.

Bournemouth - Let's face it, had Bournemouth not been so profligate in front of goal and Silvestri not been on fire, we could and perhaps should have been 3 or 4 down iby HT. No doubts the comeback in 2nd half was great but we were lucky not to be too far behind at that stage.

Huddersfield - I watched this game on live stream and whilst we played well, it has to be said that Hudds were pathetic that day. Did they make us look better than we were/are ?

I am not trying to be negative in the way I have viewed those games but to me there is some semblance of truth in thinking that we were considerably flattered by the results that Redders got during that spell.
Indeed Gurj :tup: weaker teams & we had a bit of luck on the way

Our fans forget the current LUFC team has been recently assembled & are still getting to know each other where as Reading have built their team over the last few years, the Royals looked a solid outfit

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Brader » Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:17 pm

Flattest atmosphere i can recall at elland road, way too many sideways and backwards balls when we needed to be trying to push forward with some pace. Which is exactly my problem with last nights performance.... Back 4 looked solid (apart from cooper struggling positionally but who can blame him out of position) but there was no urgency about going forward and rarely troubled a very organised reading defence.

Its not often i say this at all but it was only when austin came on that we looked like we actually wanted to win this game and actually had someone who could unlock the last pass, Sharp has to start next game in my eyes.....

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Gino 1959 » Thu Oct 02, 2014 5:27 pm

Brader wrote:way too many sideways and backwards balls
Just like Ronan then.
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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by eastyorkshirewhite » Thu Oct 02, 2014 5:59 pm

Made our 1st visit to Elland Road this season to witness a poor game with two average sides of which there are many in this division a bit surprised by the team selected and the changes he made.Thought the midfield gave the ball away far to easy.Cant rally remember many shots that hit the target either.On the whole the game proved our points we made at the start of the season not to renew our season tickets and to watch Leeds away and go to other matcdhes of our choice at least that way we get the chance of a good day out and to visit new grounds especially non league ones.

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by theleedsmango » Thu Oct 02, 2014 7:34 pm

Gurj wrote:In other words did we really play that well in that period. Yes we picked up 10 points out of 12 and you cannot question the importance of that but stats can be deceptive.
Did someone say stats?

Here's some ratings for the Hockaday era, the Redfearn transition and the Darko revolution...

--------------------------------Hockaday---------------Redfearn--------------Darko---------
Ave Possession--------------49% (14th)--------------49% (11th)--------------51% (8th)-------
Completed passes---------1343 (8th)--------------1259 (10th)--------------420 (1st)-------
Passing accuracy------------79%(8th)----------------80% (5th)---------------86% (1st)-------
Key Passes-------------------23 (24th)----------------27 (22nd)---------------11 (7th)-------
Shot Accuracy---------------35% (19th)---------------50% (7th)-------------38% (10th)------
Interceptions-----------------21 (20th)------------------35 (5th)----------------15 (4th)-------
Tackles won----------------48% (15th)-----------------38% (22nd)------------46% (16th)-------

I know it's not definitive as they are based on different length of spells but they do tell an interesting story. I've put the relative position of Leeds against other teams in the Championship for the same period since the periods are different lengths for each manager.

Points of interest:
We have definitely become a 'passing side', in fact in performance indicators, as a whole we are 4th in the league for passing, behind Wolves, Derby and Bournemouth.
Redfearn got a boost from more accurate shots. Perhaps the players felt a little bit of pressure lifted when Redfearn was in charge? A coach can only set the team up, there is little he can do if the strikers fail to convert.
We need to improve on winning the ball and making possession count. We are still pretty poor defensively (intercepting and tackling) and no doubt Silvestri has helped us maintain a higher position than we deserve. We have the worst defensive performance indicator in the league! Interestingly, solid Reading only came in at 22nd.

I suppose the key thing to take is we are improving. In nearly all areas mentioned above, we have improved (bar interceptions.)
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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by eastyorkshirewhite » Thu Oct 02, 2014 7:39 pm

theleedsmango wrote:
Did someone say stats?

Here's some ratings for the Hockaday era, the Redfearn transition and the Darko revolution...

--------------------------------Hockaday---------------Redfearn--------------Darko---------
Ave Possession--------------49% (14th)--------------49% (11th)--------------51% (8th)-------
Completed passes---------1343 (8th)--------------1259 (10th)--------------420 (1st)-------
Passing accuracy------------79%(8th)----------------80% (5th)---------------86% (1st)-------
Key Passes-------------------23 (24th)----------------27 (22nd)---------------11 (7th)-------
Shot Accuracy---------------35% (19th)---------------50% (7th)-------------38% (10th)------
Interceptions-----------------21 (20th)------------------35 (5th)----------------15 (4th)-------
Tackles won----------------48% (15th)-----------------38% (22nd)------------46% (16th)-------

I know it's not definitive as they are based on different length of spells but they do tell an interesting story. I've put the relative position of Leeds against other teams in the Championship for the same period since the periods are different lengths for each manager.

Points of interest:
We have definitely become a 'passing side', in fact in performance indicators, as a whole we are 4th in the league for passing, behind Wolves, Derby and Bournemouth.
Redfearn got a boost from more accurate shots. Perhaps the players felt a little bit of pressure lifted when Redfearn was in charge? A coach can only set the team up, there is little he can do if the strikers fail to convert.
We need to improve on winning the ball and making possession count. We are still pretty poor defensively (intercepting and tackling) and no doubt Silvestri has helped us maintain a higher position than we deserve. We have the worst defensive performance indicator in the league! Interestingly, solid Reading only came in at 22nd.

I suppose the key thing to take is we are improving. In nearly all areas mentioned above, we have improved (bar interceptions.)
The players looked more relaxed under Redfearn I thought and he seemed to have their respect.

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Twiggster » Thu Oct 02, 2014 8:10 pm

eastyorkshirewhite wrote:The players looked more relaxed under Redfearn I thought and he seemed to have their respect.
Heard that from a lot of match going fans. Not seen much of Darko's team, through lack of streams - but saw a fair few hock and Redders managed games live on line. When Redders took over from the conference pretend coach, the players IMMEDIATELY seemed to get a spring in their step, started really playing and looked like they were actually enjoying their jobs.
So why haven't the players done the same for Donnie? :duno:

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Martyn » Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:09 pm

theleedsmango wrote:
Did someone say stats?

Here's some ratings for the Hockaday era, the Redfearn transition and the Darko revolution...

--------------------------------Hockaday---------------Redfearn--------------Darko---------
Ave Possession--------------49% (14th)--------------49% (11th)--------------51% (8th)-------
Completed passes---------1343 (8th)--------------1259 (10th)--------------420 (1st)-------
Passing accuracy------------79%(8th)----------------80% (5th)---------------86% (1st)-------
Key Passes-------------------23 (24th)----------------27 (22nd)---------------11 (7th)-------
Shot Accuracy---------------35% (19th)---------------50% (7th)-------------38% (10th)------
Interceptions-----------------21 (20th)------------------35 (5th)----------------15 (4th)-------
Tackles won----------------48% (15th)-----------------38% (22nd)------------46% (16th)-------

I know it's not definitive as they are based on different length of spells but they do tell an interesting story. I've put the relative position of Leeds against other teams in the Championship for the same period since the periods are different lengths for each manager.

Points of interest:
We have definitely become a 'passing side', in fact in performance indicators, as a whole we are 4th in the league for passing, behind Wolves, Derby and Bournemouth.
Redfearn got a boost from more accurate shots. Perhaps the players felt a little bit of pressure lifted when Redfearn was in charge? A coach can only set the team up, there is little he can do if the strikers fail to convert.
We need to improve on winning the ball and making possession count. We are still pretty poor defensively (intercepting and tackling) and no doubt Silvestri has helped us maintain a higher position than we deserve. We have the worst defensive performance indicator in the league! Interestingly, solid Reading only came in at 22nd.

I suppose the key thing to take is we are improving. In nearly all areas mentioned above, we have improved (bar interceptions.)
There are too many gaps in those stats though mango. For example, shot accuracy at 38% is meaningless unless you know number of shots. With the way we are playing in the last two games it appears we hardly shoot at all, under Redders (with a shot accuracy of 50%) we were getting forward and shooting.

Would you rather have 38% of 1 shot per game on target, or 50% of 12 shots?
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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by Genghers » Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:19 pm

Guildford White wrote:There are too many gaps in those stats though mango. For example, shot accuracy at 38% is meaningless unless you know number of shots. With the way we are playing in the last two games it appears we hardly shoot at all, under Redders (with a shot accuracy of 50%) we were getting forward and shooting.

Would you rather have 38% of 1 shot per game on target, or 50% of 12 shots?
What's 38% of one shot? :P

I see your point though, but that's always the thing with stats - people use them to illustrate the point they want to make, but ignore the ones which might be most relevant. But I think Mango knows that and was making a point of it!

I think, as with a lot of these things, it's going to take time for the team to adapt to the new regime of training/changes to the play style, even if they are small. We saw a huge improvement from Hockaday to Redders as poor Dave was out of his depth and clueless. It would have been a big surprise if Darko had come in and made us markedly better again. I'm sure we'll improve with more training/game time, we just need to find the perfect formula to break down (better) defences...

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by 1964white » Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:21 pm

Twiggster wrote:
Heard that from a lot of match going fans. Not seen much of Darko's team, through lack of streams - but saw a fair few hock and Redders managed games live on line. When Redders took over from the conference pretend coach, the players IMMEDIATELY seemed to get a spring in their step, started really playing and looked like they were actually enjoying their jobs.
So why haven't the players done the same for Donnie? :duno:
All i can add is we worked very hard to keep a clean sheet & earn a draw v Reading, we'd have caved in over the last few seasons, they smashed four past us in 2013/14

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Re: Leeds v Reading : Team/Reports/Ratings

Post by faaip » Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:35 pm

Not enough evidence to form an opinion
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