Paul Heckingbottom

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by 1964white » Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:32 am

Cjay wrote:
Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:11 pm

He thought Alex Mowett was Championship quality
Don't know what he was thinking there, the Tykes soon shipped him Mowatt out on loan though

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by 1964white » Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 am

I still refuse blame the managers for the demise of our club, the problems lye much deeper than that.

The fans on the terraces are aiming the blame at the right culprits

Apart from BPF, O'Connor & Pearce there is no light at the end of the tunnel right now. Our more experienced players have let us down big-time, many of them are not good or fit enough to wear the white shirt of Leeds

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:14 pm

Quite a few things i dont understand.

Leon you say that those in the stands are aiming there fury at the right people not Heckingbottom.

They booed TC and it was there reaction that played a large part in getting TC sacked.

But apparently Hecky should be allowed to bring in his own players.

Effectively getting a free pass over 16 games.

If the fans believe the squad isnt good enough and it isnt Paul's fault then why were they calling for TC to be sacked?

Makes no sense.

TC as others said never had us as low, this far off the playoffs, this poor a goal difference.

Yet he was at fault with the same players minus Forshaw and the same setup.

Hecky though is absolved of all blame and deserves a chance next season.

Despite Hecky having shown nothing in his time in this league to suggest he is anything but Relegation fodder as a manager.

29 games and 3 wins, over 50% with His Players at Barnsley who since he left have improved.

There manager has done better with Hecky's squad then Hecky did.

So what that means is 2 different managers this season have been in charge of the same sets of players as Heckingbottom and both have got more points.

Doesnt that suggest that no matter opinions on squads if 2 managers can do better then him then maybe Hecky isnt much good and those wishing him to stay and have time are doing that more to validate there anger at Orta and Radz then they are genuine faith in Heckingbottom.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by 1964white » Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:23 pm

Did TC get booed Cjay ?

I recall the players being booed off the pitch a few times

Btw I'm not a boo-boy personally

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:31 pm

1964white wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:23 pm
Did TC get booed Cjay ?

I recall the players being booed off the pitch a few times

Btw I'm not a boo-boy personally
I definitely heard a chant of "you dont know what ya doing".

But what baffles me is why Hecky deserves a chance?

He's had a chance, 13 games.

If we were willing to right off this season (as saying Hecky deserves next season suggests).

Why sack TC at all?

Dont think i could bare a season of Heckingbottom and his clichés.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:07 pm

I've said before, but there is a feel of xenophobia about it all. TC would be out the door already if he had started this badly and would still be in a job if he was English. I blame the media, because they're the ones pushing this narrative that Heck is good and TC deserved the sack.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:19 pm

SG90 wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:07 pm
I've said before, but there is a feel of xenophobia about it all. TC would be out the door already if he had started this badly and would still be in a job if he was English. I blame the media, because they're the ones pushing this narrative that Heck is good and TC deserved the sack.
You may have a point unfortunately.

Lot of English managers with average records yet there "talented young coaches".

Based on what?

Hecky has 8 wins in 50 or something ridiculous.

Rowett has a Championship win percent of 40% ish

Lee Johnson similar.

Its not particularly spectacular.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:25 pm

Cjay wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:19 pm
You may have a point unfortunately.

Lot of English managers with average records yet there "talented young coaches".

Based on what?

Hecky has 8 wins in 50 or something ridiculous.

Rowett has a Championship win percent of 40% ish

Lee Johnson similar.

Its not particularly spectacular.
10 wins from 63 :poo: It will be unfair when he gets the boot though. :roll:

Look how much stick Ipswich are getting for getting rid of Mick McCarthy. I'm sure their fans know far more than the media do.

Idiots like Merson and Soccer Saturday saying "you need an English manager who knows the league" and all this nonsense. Last two Championship winners have been foreign.

The sad thing is TC was rubbished as being from Cyprus when he came, no one mentioned he was ex Barcelona/Cruyff, managed in the UCL and Europa League etc. Yet Heck has great pedigree as he won the JPT, give me a break.

Graham Potter is a great English manager, but his CV is no better than TC's.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:11 pm

SG90 wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:25 pm
10 wins from 63 :poo: It will be unfair when he gets the boot though. :roll:

Look how much stick Ipswich are getting for getting rid of Mick McCarthy. I'm sure their fans know far more than the media do.

Idiots like Merson and Soccer Saturday saying "you need an English manager who knows the league" and all this nonsense. Last two Championship winners have been foreign.

The sad thing is TC was rubbished as being from Cyprus when he came, no one mentioned he was ex Barcelona/Cruyff, managed in the UCL and Europa League etc. Yet Heck has great pedigree as he won the JPT, give me a break.

Graham Potter is a great English manager, but his CV is no better than TC's.
As you say makes no sense.

Best Championship manager imo right now is Slav Jokanovic at Fulham.

Then there was Oscar Garcia at Brighton.

Rafa Benitez at Newcastle.

David Wagner at Huddersfield.

Nuno at Wolves

Ok Rafa and Nuno probably had pretty easy jobs based on players.

But then further back Jean Tigana at Fulham.

Aitor Karanka at Boro.

All of them had as good or better Championship records then practically any English manager.

On the whole there teams were better to watch.

Hecky, Johnson, Monk, Rowett, none of them have made the playoffs, all of the above did at a minimum

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:21 pm

Jokanovic finished 21st in his first season and Wagner finished 19th, they were allowed time to build. TC was 10th, far better than both. Joke of a decision to get rid, especially as we were trying to get the u23s and first team playing the same style.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:55 pm

I bet Hecky is incredibly dull giving teams talks.

"Fight for 2nd balls"
"Show passion"
"Ger stuck in"
"You are where you deserve to be"


His press conferences are boring as well.
"We know where we wanna be"
"We deserve where we are"
"We are working hard for next season"
"Individual errors cost us"
"I'm learning every game"
"We are working hard"
"I've been learning for 13 games, next season be better, just ask Barnsley, i can win 8 games if given a chance".

There's also the Brian Clough thing.

He came in as a successful coach, told the players "throw your medals away", and that was that for him.

Hecky has come in as a loser, a man in a relegation battle. Told the players who have been in the top 6 most of the season "your not good enough", thats effectively what he has said.

Why would those players fight for him at all?

In any walk off life a manager comes in with a worse record then your previous manager then tells YOU your not good enough.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:26 pm

You could just imagine Saiz, Pablo and co's reaction when he was unveiled to them. A collection of scratched heads and "who". Then the grinning idiot AK would have been spouting nonsense about his "great record" of 1 win in 16 games and how much of a coup he was. :lol:

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by 1964white » Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:54 pm

SG90 wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:21 pm
Jokanovic finished 21st in his first season and Wagner finished 19th, they were allowed time to build. TC was 10th, far better than both. Joke of a decision to get rid, especially as we were trying to get the u23s and first team playing the same style.
Thing is SG we wouldn't have finished 10th even if Christiansen had remained at Leeds. We were in our second rut of the season going nowhere with us only gaining two boring 0-0 draws in TC's last seven matches.

I said to my mates as we came out of St Andrews after our abysmal loss at the end of December.

"That's it our season is over"

We were that bad.....how right I was :P

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:13 pm

1964white wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:54 pm
Thing is SG we wouldn't have finished 10th even if Christiansen had remained at Leeds. We were in our second rut of the season going nowhere with us only gaining two boring 0-0 draws in TC's last seven matches.

I said to my mates as we came out of St Andrews after our abysmal loss at the end of December.

"That's it our season is over"

We were that bad.....how right I was :P
So why can't TC use the Saiz ban excuse like Heck can or the red cards? No way would TC have us down in 14th. As bad as things got under him, 7 defeats in 9, we were never lower than 10th or had a negative goal difference.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by 1964white » Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:47 pm

SG90 wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:13 pm
So why can't TC use the Saiz ban excuse like Heck can or the red cards? No way would TC have us down in 14th. As bad as things got under him, 7 defeats in 9, we were never lower than 10th or had a negative goal difference.
I just think the current managerial Leeds job is a thankless task

I've watched these players jog aimlessly around the pitch for much of the season

They can't pass or cross a ball, can't tackle can't defend, cant shoot or score goals, rarely press the opposition, errors all over the park in far too many games, poor attitude & discipline, the most soft-bellied Leeds squad I've witnessed in six decades

So far this season we've used these numbers in positions

3 x keepers
4 x RB's
6 x LB's
7 x CB's
5 x DM's
6 x RW
4 x AM
4 x LW
4 x STR

Says it all how poor our players are.....average/inconsistent, can't hold their place in the team hence no continuity

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by Cjay » Sun Apr 15, 2018 7:40 pm


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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by NorfolkWhite » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:46 am

Cjay wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:11 pm
As you say makes no sense.

Best Championship manager imo right now is Slav Jokanovic at Fulham.

Then there was Oscar Garcia at Brighton.

Rafa Benitez at Newcastle.

David Wagner at Huddersfield.

Nuno at Wolves

Ok Rafa and Nuno probably had pretty easy jobs based on players.

But then further back Jean Tigana at Fulham.

Aitor Karanka at Boro.

All of them had as good or better Championship records then practically any English manager.

On the whole there teams were better to watch.

Hecky, Johnson, Monk, Rowett, none of them have made the playoffs, all of the above did at a minimum
Heard a comment on sky yesterday during the Wolves game that Brum were 4th highest spenders in the league and also had an experienced English manager in Harry ...... disproves the myths that you need a manager who knows the league and spend decent amounts of cash to guarantee success.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by radebe88 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:29 am

Clive wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:27 pm
Darko lost 3 and drew 3 of his 6 games.

Heckingbottom has taken 4 points from his last 6 games and lost 4 of them.

We scored 4 and conceded 8 under Darko, in Heck's last 6 we've scored 5 and conceded 10.

I knew Heckingbottom would be no good, but I thought Saiz would come back and we'd finish the season strongly, and he wouldn't be exposed until next season.

The whole situation is painfully embarrassing for Radrizzani, Heckingbottom, the club, the media who talk him up and the fans who defend him.
I thought Saiz would improve our season too. PH keeps leaving him out though. Send that great bleeding apeth back darnt pit

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:32 am

radebe88 wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:29 am
I thought Saiz would improve our season too. PH keeps leaving him out though. Send that great bleeding apeth back darnt pit
Probably because he doesn't know what to do with him. "His" players are those with limited talent who get stuck in and hover in lower midtable.

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Re: Paul Heckingbottom

Post by SG90 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:33 am

NorfolkWhite wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:46 am
Heard a comment on sky yesterday during the Wolves game that Brum were 4th highest spenders in the league and also had an experienced English manager in Harry ...... disproves the myths that you need a manager who knows the league and spend decent amounts of cash to guarantee success.
Exactly. Sadly this myth will continue when PH is finally sacked.

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