Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

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Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:51 pm

Ayling was having a good game so why take him off for Dallas who wasn't going to offer more.

Alioski is a better wing-back than the plodding Douglas, surely Clarke for Harrison would have been a better substitution & leave Ali in his preferred position.

Klich was having a decent game, unsure why he had to go too?

Douglas hasn't been great for months so bringing on our injury prone/out of form wing-backs when chasing the game didn't make sense to me

Clarke or Shackleton for Harrison should have been the only change

Too many changes tends to disrupts the rhythm of play. Rare move from Marcelo as he normally persists with much of his first eleven

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by SG90 » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:01 pm

Clarke was poor today tbh, though that was to be expected that he was rusty. Shackleton and Brown or even Bogusz would have been perfect subs today.

For some reason, Bielsa has to always bring on Douglas and Dallas. I don't understand it myself.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by faaip » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:08 pm

I get the Douglas thing personally, Alio had very nearly given up a pen and is a poor defender plus it allows us to push him forward. No idea why Ayling and Klich came off, both were unlocking the SU Defence at will. I'm not Ayling's biggest fan but he was having a stonker today. Dallas is Mr bland, Offer ok defence, adds little pace and little creativity. He's a workmanlike back up in times of need..
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by Cjay » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:20 pm

MB is very sutbborn, he has a pecking order and he sticks to it, mentioned it earlier this season it bugs me no end.

Douglas, Dallas, Forshaw will be in our matchday 18 if fit whenever and will replace Ayling or Harrison in Dallas case.

Harrison usually in Douglas case with Ali going wide on the wing.

And Klich in Forshaws case.

Occasionally he changes it with Clarke and Shacks but the pecking order has been evident all season.

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:45 pm

faaip wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:08 pm
I get the Douglas thing personally, Alio had very nearly given up a pen and is a poor defender plus it allows us to push him forward. No idea why Ayling and Klich came off, both were unlocking the SU Defence at will. I'm not Ayling's biggest fan but he was having a stonker today. Dallas is Mr bland, Offer ok defence, adds little pace and little creativity. He's a workmanlike back up in times of need..
Dallas or Douglas coming on as subs if we were winning made sense if we were looking to close up shop, to bring them both on as attacking options was ludicrous

Still think Alioski is more suited in the wing-back role, was anonymous when pushed forward.

Nice to see Ayling getting some praise :tup:

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by weasel » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:47 pm

Okay firstly Brown are Bogusz were never going to be options today as they both played 120 minutes on Thursday night. Unfortunately due to the circumstances with the U23 keeper getting sent off and that match going to 120 minutes it wasn't possible to rotate the players better in that match. Douglas had come off at half time and possibly Bogusz or Brown would have come off around 60 minutes if not for the keeper red card forcing the club to make the 3rd substitution in bringing on the back up keeper. As it was it then also meant Shackleton and Clarke ended up playing 75 minutes instead of 45 minutes too. Hindsight would have helped in terms of rotation but it explains some of the potential problems with subs as Shackleton may not have been 100% and certainly Clarke looked either tired or rusty or both.

As such Douglas was fresh and the choice to bring him on and push Alioski forward was probably a sensible one given that Alioski had gone in a bit rashly moments earlier and could have given a penalty away if he had caught his man. Douglas like Ayling before needs to get back to his best so giving him minutes makes sense as well.

Dallas for Ayling is simply fresh legs with probably a bit more of an attacking threat. Bielsa has often spoke about how he prefers to rotate his wide players as they do most running. Okay yes I'd have liked to have seen Shackleton but maybe he wasn't 100% - don't forget that this was the first time for a long time that Bielsa didn't name his team at the press conference so perhaps there were doubts.

Disappointed that Klich came off but equally who else do you take off to get Clarke on? Roberts, Bamford, Hernandez - all 3 are capable of scoring out of nothing. Probably the only really attacking decision that could have been taken instead would have been to take either Phillips or a centreback off but that would have left us very vulnerable to a second goal. At 1-0 all it needs is 1 chance (on target), 2-0 and it is game over.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:50 pm

Cjay wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:20 pm
MB is very sutbborn, he has a pecking order and he sticks to it, mentioned it earlier this season it bugs me no end.

Douglas, Dallas, Forshaw will be in our matchday 18 if fit whenever and will replace Ayling or Harrison in Dallas case.

Harrison usually in Douglas case with Ali going wide on the wing.

And Klich in Forshaws case.

Occasionally he changes it with Clarke and Shacks but the pecking order has been evident all season.
I dislike strict pecking orders, he needs to be more flexible !

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by HarryofOz » Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:51 pm

weasel wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:47 pm
Okay firstly Brown are Bogusz were never going to be options today as they both played 120 minutes on Thursday night. Unfortunately due to the circumstances with the U23 keeper getting sent off and that match going to 120 minutes it wasn't possible to rotate the players better in that match. Douglas had come off at half time and possibly Bogusz or Brown would have come off around 60 minutes if not for the keeper red card forcing the club to make the 3rd substitution in bringing on the back up keeper. As it was it then also meant Shackleton and Clarke ended up playing 75 minutes instead of 45 minutes too. Hindsight would have helped in terms of rotation but it explains some of the potential problems with subs as Shackleton may not have been 100% and certainly Clarke looked either tired or rusty or both.

As such Douglas was fresh and the choice to bring him on and push Alioski forward was probably a sensible one given that Alioski had gone in a bit rashly moments earlier and could have given a penalty away if he had caught his man. Douglas like Ayling before needs to get back to his best so giving him minutes makes sense as well.

Dallas for Ayling is simply fresh legs with probably a bit more of an attacking threat. Bielsa has often spoke about how he prefers to rotate his wide players as they do most running. Okay yes I'd have liked to have seen Shackleton but maybe he wasn't 100% - don't forget that this was the first time for a long time that Bielsa didn't name his team at the press conference so perhaps there were doubts.

Disappointed that Klich came off but equally who else do you take off to get Clarke on? Roberts, Bamford, Hernandez - all 3 are capable of scoring out of nothing. Probably the only really attacking decision that could have been taken instead would have been to take either Phillips or a centreback off but that would have left us very vulnerable to a second goal. At 1-0 all it needs is 1 chance (on target), 2-0 and it is game over.
Agreed, all the subs were logical at the time even though we ended up losing the game.

Douglas for Harrison and push Alioski upfront.

Dallas for Ayling fresh legs and similar roles

Clarke for Klich also fresh legs and Clarke has been a talisman super-sub for us. The only other realistic choices to go off - as Weasel as pointed out - were Hernandez, Roberts and Bamford. Hernandez and Roberts were playing well and taking off Bamford would have meant taking off our main striker when we needed goals.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:00 pm

HarryofOz wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:51 pm
Agreed, all the subs were logical at the time even though we ended up losing the game.

Douglas for Harrison and push Alioski upfront.

Dallas for Ayling fresh legs and similar roles

Clarke for Klich also fresh legs and Clarke has been a talisman super-sub for us. The only other realistic choices to go off - as Weasel as pointed out - were Hernandez, Roberts and Bamford. Hernandez and Roberts were playing well and taking off Bamford would have meant taking off our main striker when we needed goals.
Imo Harry there was no need to take Ayling off who still looked full of running as far as I could see

Leave Alioski at the back & put Clarke on the left, much more balanced that way without making four positional changes

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by HarryofOz » Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:06 pm

1964white wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:00 pm
Imo Harry there was no need to take Ayling off who still looked full of running as far as I could see

Leave Alioski at the back & put Clarke on the left, much more balanced that way without making four positional changes
No-one was playing badly though and we continued to play just as well after the subs. We created as many chances, so there was no negative impact. The only problem was, that just like had happened until those subs were made, we failed to score afterwards.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by Irish Ian » Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:17 pm

HarryofOz wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:51 pm
Agreed, all the subs were logical at the time even though we ended up losing the game.

Douglas for Harrison and push Alioski upfront.

Dallas for Ayling fresh legs and similar roles

Clarke for Klich also fresh legs and Clarke has been a talisman super-sub for us. The only other realistic choices to go off - as Weasel as pointed out - were Hernandez, Roberts and Bamford. Hernandez and Roberts were playing well and taking off Bamford would have meant taking off our main striker when we needed goals.
Agreed as well. I know frustration can rule at times but when the subs came on we did look like overloading them. It was only when Kiko got sent off that the sting went out of our play.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:29 am

What does Douglas do to change a game? Absolutely nothing. Biggest let down of the season . We got worse when he came on and no one can deny that.

It's happened several times this season and it's not just his involvement its the insistence on partnering him up with Alioski. They're a crap partnership down that side and I don't even think they like each other.

Alioski isn't a winger, never has been, he's a wing-back who battles and runs and overlaps and keeps opposition players on that left side on their toes for 90 minutes. His end product is poor but he's athletically very gifted and will give you a couple of moments a game just from the pure volume of crossing opportunities and effort he puts in. He's a much better option at full back than Douglas but Douglas, whilst a massive disappointment this season, is a better crosser on the whole but then again that isn't saying much. Then there's Harrison a player in a similar mould to Alioski who seeks solace in graft and tracking back to distract from his infuriating lack of attacking instinct and poor decision-making.


You can see why we wanted James and how crucial he would've been. We're "making do" on that side atm with no options of any merit when we want to change things. We move Alioski forward but seemingly ask Douglas to stay high too when he comes on and all of a sudden we look open at left back and the sight of a galloping Douglas trying to get back and Alioski at the other end looking a bit clueless is a common one.

Watching Wolves beat Man U on the telly last night I can't help feeling we spent £3 million on their worst player

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by gessa » Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:44 am

1964white wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:00 pm
Imo Harry there was no need to take Ayling off who still looked full of running as far as I could see

Leave Alioski at the back & put Clarke on the left, much more balanced that way without making four positional changes

Ayling had a poor start, he grew into the game and at the time of the substitution was the 3rd best player on the pitch. Dallas is a solid option if you want to close the game down , he's not a game changer. I could see the logic of Douglas coming on as Harrison wasn't offering much but that didn't work either, Douglas was lagging at getting back for the goal and Alioski's game deteriorated by going more forward. The game was crying out for Shackleton not Clarke. All matter of opinion of course.

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:04 am

gessa wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:44 am
Ayling had a poor start, he grew into the game and at the time of the substitution was the 3rd best player on the pitch. Dallas is a solid option if you want to close the game down , he's not a game changer. I could see the logic of Douglas coming on as Harrison wasn't offering much but that didn't work either, Douglas was lagging at getting back for the goal and Alioski's game deteriorated by going more forward. The game was crying out for Shackleton not Clarke. All matter of opinion of course.
Shackleton was also a good option, he seems to be behind in the pecking order now Dallas & Douglas are supposedly fit again. Young Shacks would have given us more energy & pace which was required than the limited Dallas & the treading on water Douglas, he has changed games in his limited time on the pitch previously. Moving Alioski forward to accommodate Douglas doesn't work, Ali looked ineffective when Bielsa made the same change at Reading, the key there though is we were coasting the game.
God help us if Bielsa thinks Douglas & Dallas are game-changers :(

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:10 am

gessa wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:44 am
Ayling had a poor start, he grew into the game and at the time of the substitution was the 3rd best player on the pitch. Dallas is a solid option if you want to close the game down , he's not a game changer. I could see the logic of Douglas coming on as Harrison wasn't offering much but that didn't work either, Douglas was lagging at getting back for the goal and Alioski's game deteriorated by going more forward. The game was crying out for Shackleton not Clarke. All matter of opinion of course.
Ayling was one of our best players, he'll run all day for you he doesn't know the meaning of the word tiredness. The ER faithful were not happy when he was subbed.

You should of heard the crowd howl when Dallas deliberated on the ball twice, not the type of player that should have come on when we are chasing a game !

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by Cjay » Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:25 am

Wolves fans did warn us about Douglas tbf, the man is a defensive liability and if you take away his set pieces then he offer nothing.

Dallas is the most bland jack of all trades master of none we have ever had, everything is just average.

Douglas was also at fault for the goal (with Cooper).

Still annoyed about yesterday.

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by weasel » Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:52 am

1964white wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:10 am
You should of heard the crowd howl when Dallas deliberated on the ball twice, not the type of player that should have come on when we are chasing a game !
Probably about the only time the crowd was heard after Sheff Utd scored. When the team needed a lift all they got was glum faces in the crowd and a library atmosphere.
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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:00 am

weasel wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:52 am
Probably about the only time the crowd was heard after Sheff Utd scored. When the team needed a lift all they got was glum faces in the crowd and a library atmosphere.
Not a good shout having a pop at fans who pay good money to watch LUFC

Only natural our noise levels lessened after a frustrating afternoon. It really is a two way thing for the crowd/team to get each other going, had our players shooting ability been much more accurate we we wouldn't be discussing a defeat today, no shots out of seventeen efforts is quite simply feeble. We should have been out of sight with three points in the bag by half-time, these type of defeats are always on the cards when we don't capitalise on so many decent opportunities. The opposition only need one chance to score & boom the three points needlessly chucked away.
As for Dallas trying to shoot at a crowded area when a simple pass to our talisman Pablo stood in oceans of space was nothing short of shocking !

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by 1964white » Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:06 am

Cjay wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:25 am
Wolves fans did warn us about Douglas tbf, the man is a defensive liability and if you take away his set pieces then he offer nothing.

Dallas is the most bland jack of all trades master of none we have ever had, everything is just average.

Douglas was also at fault for the goal (with Cooper).

Still annoyed about yesterday.
Said throughout the season Cjay we haven't got a bench to win games, we've got plenty of average plodders who can help out if we need to keep things tight or to rest tired legs but beyond our first eleven we are really struggling if we are not commanding a game

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Re: Ayling/Klich/Harrison = Douglas/Dallas/Clarke

Post by SG90 » Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:13 am

1964white wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:06 am
Said throughout the season Cjay we haven't got a bench to win games, we've got plenty of average plodders who can help out if we need to keep things tight or to rest tired legs but beyond our first eleven we are really struggling if we are not commanding a game
Brown, Clarke, Bogusz and Shack are all game changers. Yesterday we were crying out for Shack a bit of pace to run at them with.
Casilla - Douglas - NEW - Jansson - Shackleton - Phillips - Klich - NEW - NEW - Clarke - NEW

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