MB Issues

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Cjay
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MB Issues

Post by Cjay » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:44 pm

Not suggesting MB should be sacked or anything ridiculous but no manager is beyond criticism.

Dan made a good point, for all the analysis we do not much changes.

The style is the same every game, the selection is the same every game and usually the subs are the same.

Patrick Bamford has acored 1 goal in his last 7 games at Elland Road.

Jack Harrison in games where he has played 45 minutes or more has contributed through goals or assists 8 times directly in 41 games.

At Elland Road you have to go back to April 13th for his last direct contribution at Elland Road and then all the way back to February for another one (yes he played the majority of those games ).

Point is MB with all his stats must know things like this, yet come Charlton whats the betting that its the same team?

If something isnt working and at home it isnt surely we should change? You adapt and try something else.

MB is as stubborn as they come, good and bad, but something is wrong and ive supported Paddy but at Elland Road he has a problem.

Jack Harrison got by on grit last season but how much longer? Costa is class at this level, not a side in this league would have him on the bench.

For all the domination and what not you could take the summary of the Derby game and apply it to Forest, Swansea already this season and then off the top of my head, Sheffield United, Wigan, Birmingham last season.

It isnt all MBs fault of course and very pleased he is here but when you are experiencing the same problems over and over again for 12 months then surely the manager has to do something to try and change it?

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Re: MB Issues

Post by Mick Jones shoulder » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:58 pm

Have to agree with the caveat that Bamford's hold up play is nesscerary plain to see and when Harrison goes off we look vulnerable down the left when Alioski plays in front of Douglas. You have a solution? As you say a coach of Bielsa standing should have solved this by now. Goals obviously win games not possession 🙄

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Re: MB Issues

Post by Cjay » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:12 pm

Mick Jones shoulder wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:58 pm
Have to agree with the caveat that Bamford's hold up play is nesscerary plain to see and when Harrison goes off we look vulnerable down the left when Alioski plays in front of Douglas. You have a solution? As you say a coach of Bielsa standing should have solved this by now. Goals obviously win games not possession 🙄
Nope not really but.

Bringing on Douglas to make yourself more defensively solid is daft, one of the worst defenders ive seen.

Would it have been better to bring on Berardi for Pablo? Moved Dallas left wing, kept Ali at Lb and played Bera behind Costa, Bera may be a bit of a loose cannon but he can defend.

Is it time to drop Paddy for his own good? Or does MB need to find a way to fit them (Paddy and Eddie) in the same side? Worked well briefly vs Brentford

I think MB did get his subs wrong, if not the players then the timing.

And i do think he needs to be a bit more flexible, try and surprise an opponent sometimes.

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Re: MB Issues

Post by Mick Jones shoulder » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:20 pm

:?: don't k ow what happened with multiple posts sorry gents
Last edited by Mick Jones shoulder on Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: MB Issues

Post by SG90 » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:41 pm

It doesn't sound like Nketiah will be starting anytime soon then, as MB is still talking about starting both, but says dropping a midfielder means we lose creativity. Why can't you just drop Bamford? For that record, Harrison and Pablo deserve dropping too as they've been woeful recently.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by Mick Jones shoulder » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:21 pm

Hernandez has been poor in the last 3 games have to agree

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Re: MB Issues

Post by weasel » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:22 pm

Cjay wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:44 pm
For all the domination and what not you could take the summary of the Derby game and apply it to Forest, Swansea already this season
Forest score in the 77th minute.

Swansea score in the 90th minute.

Derby score in the 91st minute.

Bristol City score in the 79th minute.

So we have conceded 4 goals - and all 4 goals conceded this season came late on in matches after substitutions had been made. The team Bielsa picked to start matches have yet to concede in 8 league matches.

Note that in 3 of those 4 matches, listed above, where we have conceded we were actually leading in 3 of them prior to a substitution being made, in the other we were drawing.

So out of 8 matches this season making substitutions have made us do worse in 4, better in 2 (Brentford and Barnsley) and no difference in 2 (Wigan and Stoke). That would suggest Bielsa has picked the right starting team, especially when you consider in the 2 matches where the substitutions helped us win you cannot ignore the fact that without making substitutions there was the possibility we could have still gone on to win.

If matches were stopped this season at the point Bielsa made his first substitutions we would have 18 points having won 5 and drawn 3 and would yet to have conceded a goal.

Certainly interesting facts when questioning Bielsa's stubbornness and shows how what people can think to be truth isn't actually borne out by actual facts (or statistics if you prefer).
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Re: MB Issues

Post by 1964white » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:34 pm

Mick Jones shoulder wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:21 pm
Hernandez has been poor in the last 3 games have to agree
We got worse without Pablo in our midfield

Bringing Douglas on for Hernandez was crazy. What was Bielsa thinking ?

In fact we were even poorer after all three substitutions

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Re: MB Issues

Post by 1964white » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:38 pm

weasel wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:22 pm
Forest score in the 77th minute.

Swansea score in the 90th minute.

Derby score in the 91st minute.

Bristol City score in the 79th minute.

So we have conceded 4 goals - and all 4 goals conceded this season came late on in matches after substitutions had been made. The team Bielsa picked to start matches have yet to concede in 8 league matches.

Note that in 3 of those 4 matches, listed above, where we have conceded we were actually leading in 3 of them prior to a substitution being made, in the other we were drawing.

So out of 8 matches this season making substitutions have made us do worse in 4, better in 2 (Brentford and Barnsley) and no difference in 2 (Wigan and Stoke). That would suggest Bielsa has picked the right starting team, especially when you consider in the 2 matches where the substitutions helped us win you cannot ignore the fact that without making substitutions there was the possibility we could have still gone on to win.

If matches were stopped this season at the point Bielsa made his first substitutions we would have 18 points having won 5 and drawn 3 and would yet to have conceded a goal.

Certainly interesting facts when questioning Bielsa's stubbornness and shows how what people can think to be truth isn't actually borne out by actual facts (or statistics if you prefer).
Just made a similar point about our substitutions today :tup:

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Re: MB Issues

Post by faaip » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:46 pm

The first sub was the critical turning point for me..Harrison was playing well giving our mids an outlet that vanished when he left and key in stopping them attacking our left side. Costa for Shackleton for me who was a little lost today and at the same time Nketiah for Bamford..IF you're going to make changes that is. The Douglas sub was necessary once you took off Harrison and moved Alio to LW. But it cost us 2 pts
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Re: MB Issues

Post by Irish Ian » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:08 pm

Weasel makes a great point about the late goals coming after the subs have been made.
But to balance that it is worth considering that the starting 11 has not been able to turn their domination into more than one goal a game at home and have left us hanging on to either a slim lead or not. That falls at the feet of the forwards, we rarely worked their keeper today and it was the same in the games at home this season.

Today a lot of things happened around the time Harrison went off. The crowd had went quiet and Derby brought on an extra striker, Bamford earned the pen which probably earned him 10 more mins game time, we missed it and the nerves began to jangle, Derby then refreshed their other striker and went 4-4-2, we brought Douglas on for Pablo, and now had hardly any midfield presence. We then had really no outlet apart from a late run.

But apart from the Bamford chance which hit the post in the second half we didnt look as if we had a plan.

Harrison needs to really improve his final ball or we are screwed. He may be doing some things right but Bielsaball depends on scoring lots of goals.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:21 pm

faaip wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:46 pm
The first sub was the critical turning point for me..Harrison was playing well giving our mids an outlet that vanished when he left and key in stopping them attacking our left side. Costa for Shackleton for me who was a little lost today and at the same time Nketiah for Bamford..IF you're going to make changes that is. The Douglas sub was necessary once you took off Harrison and moved Alio to LW. But it cost us 2 pts

I’d say that Harrison, as Costa who came on for him had been nullified before the sub given we were sitting so far back and not sure pressing.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:24 pm

1964white wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:38 pm
Just made a similar point about our substitutions today :tup:

We sat back after 60 mins, hardly pressed, let Keogh control the ball. What were we doing? Why did we sit so deep? The subs were an attempt to overturn that but the damage had already been done.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:25 pm

1964white wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:34 pm
We got worse without Pablo in our midfield

Bringing Douglas on for Hernandez was crazy. What was Bielsa thinking ?

In fact we were even poorer after all three substitutions

I thought Pablo looked injured, was hobbling away from the area when we had the penalty.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by faaip » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:53 pm

YorkshireSquare wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:21 pm
I’d say that Harrison, as Costa who came on for him had been nullified before the sub given we were sitting so far back and not sure pressing.
Sorry Adam having a bit of trouble understanding that, probably me or auto correct.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by faaip » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:55 pm

Hernandez didn't have a bad game, picked up a few loose balls, some intelligent passing that came to nothing..Not his fault though
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Re: MB Issues

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:58 pm

faaip wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:53 pm
Sorry Adam having a bit of trouble understanding that, probably me or auto correct.

I feel any space and threat we had on the left had already disappeared before Costa came on. Harrison himself has been quiet the 10 minutes prior.

As a team we sat back, camped out in our own half, didn’t press them, hardly broke.
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Re: MB Issues

Post by faaip » Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:20 pm

YorkshireSquare wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:58 pm
I feel any space and threat we had on the left had already disappeared before Costa came on. Harrison himself has been quiet the 10 minutes prior.

As a team we sat back, camped out in our own half, didn’t press them, hardly broke.
Ahh ok, not sure that was down to Harrison who was one of our biggest threats on the day.

O/T I'm getting a privacy error everytime I do anything on MOT atm and it's saying the licence or something ran out yesterday
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Re: MB Issues

Post by faaip » Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:20 pm

Security certificate ran out yesterday
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Re: MB Issues

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:22 pm

faaip wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:20 pm
Ahh ok, not sure that was down to Harrison who was one of our biggest threats on the day.

O/T I'm getting a privacy error everytime I do anything on MOT atm and it's saying the licence or something ran out yesterday

No, not blaming Harrison in the slightest, or Costa for making little impact. I just felt we sat too deep as a whole from the hour mark onward which ultimately lead to our downfall. The equaliser felt inevitable.

Just got that error this evening, will check it out!
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