What Do You Think of Us?

For everything Leeds United related and everything not - Have your say... the Marching on Together way!
Forum rules
Please be sure you are acquainted with the forum rules outlined within our FAQs.

Help support the site by using our Amazon Affiliate link when making any purchases from Amazon.
User avatar
John in Louisiana
Manager
Manager
Posts: 4248
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:09 pm

What Do You Think of Us?

Post by John in Louisiana » Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:29 pm

I'm very curious........

What impression do UK citizens ( or Aussies, Harry) have of what is going on in the USA these days?

I'm very much interested in knowing what the view looks like from across the pond.

I will not get offended by, or angry with, anything you have to say. I have friends from all across the political spectrum. I'm just really keen on knowing what we look like to the rest of the world right now.

User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 81614
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by 1964white » Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:45 pm

You can't judge all Americans with what's going on in your native country John

Police brutality is deplorable & shouldn't be tolerated in any walk of life

Majority of us have a similar opinion of Donald Trump.

What concerns me just as much is 1000's of UK citizens congregating in congested areas within our cities instigated by the hideous crimes in America

We're easing on lockdown & now a second spike of coronavirus is possibly imminent due to protesters seemingly forgetting social distancing rules :(

User avatar
YorkshireSquare
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 9172
Joined: Sun May 18, 2003 1:34 pm
Twitter: @motforum
Location: Leeds
Contact:

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by YorkshireSquare » Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:03 pm

Whatever path you are following we seem to be close behind.

Populism is rife in both countries, incompetent, dishonest leaders who are not being held to account.
Help the site by making your Amazon purchases through our afiliate link.

Clacton White
Reserve Player
Reserve Player
Posts: 437
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:56 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Clacton White » Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:22 pm

To me it seems Trump has taken the USA back 60 years in time , he has that Nixon attitude ( from here IMO anyway ) of if the President says something then its OK . What the actual people of USA feel towards Trump I don't know , it looks like a lot seem to think he can do no wrong and will blindly follow him whatever without question . He seems to have tried to pick a fight with almost every nation on the planet - history tells us that you can't fight on multiple fronts whoever you are and one day if he stays in power , he will pick one fight too many or too much of a powerful opponent . I'd balance all of that though and say pretty much we have a mini Trump in charge here , someone as stupid , though he hasn't to my knowledge looked into the possibilities of injecting disinfectant -even if Trump wasn't serious about that , he shouldn't have said it as there will always be idiots who will think its an idea and do it .
I wouldn't judge the population of USA by Trump himself , I think a lot are wiser and will see through him .....like Boris here ( the parallels seem to be many between them ) , he started off as a bit of a joke or a decent enough bloke , but power seems to corrupt and with both , once the style is gone , you find there isn't a lot of substance to them ........ that's what I think anyway from the bits I've seen of them in the past few years .
I wondered often why I used to vote Raving Monster Loony party ........... they've moved to the major parties now by the looks of it .

User avatar
John in Louisiana
Manager
Manager
Posts: 4248
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:09 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by John in Louisiana » Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:51 pm

Thanks for the responses.

Hopefully enough of us over here will see the light and turn this president of ours out in a few months and we can go back to being the (mostly) rational, (somewhat) reliable partner we've been in the past.

What's mystifying to me is that, no matter what he does (or fails to do) his level of support among the US population never seems to waver. A lot of people voted for him four years ago thinking they might try a change from the old established order. This grand experiment has proved to be an epic failure, yet he still maintains that same 42 - 45% level of support he's always had.

And, sadly, we've seen that, because of the vicissitudes of the electoral college, a candidate with fewer votes can end up the victor.

User avatar
BobHirst
First Team
First Team
Posts: 1744
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 5:20 pm
Location: Texas

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by BobHirst » Sat Jun 06, 2020 9:18 pm

John in Louisiana wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:51 pm
Thanks for the responses.

Hopefully enough of us over here will see the light and turn this president of ours out in a few months and we can go back to being the (mostly) rational, (somewhat) reliable partner we've been in the past.

What's mystifying to me is that, no matter what he does (or fails to do) his level of support among the US population never seems to waver. A lot of people voted for him four years ago thinking they might try a change from the old established order. This grand experiment has proved to be an epic failure, yet he still maintains that same 42 - 45% level of support he's always had.

And, sadly, we've seen that, because of the vicissitudes of the electoral college, a candidate with fewer votes can end up the victor.
I agree with your words. It now seems inevitable that those 40-45% are going to stick with him whatever he says and does. One bright spot recently is the condemnation of him by some of his former flunkies who up until now have not said a word against him.

paddy parrott
First Team
First Team
Posts: 2275
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2012 8:39 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by paddy parrott » Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:02 pm

Yeah we call this Gerry mandering here in the island of Ireland John, ie keep the status quo.
No need to explain ..!
America was ' a & still is a great country..however when a hint or realisation of not only competition and another view their not content..so run amoke and ???
Trump is a ...!#@ but still a
president
Cant USA come up an alternative to an old ' un like Trump ..
Lets see the alternatives!!
JMJ .

User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 81614
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by 1964white » Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:40 am

I fully understand the reasons for the protests, but......

We are going through the worst worldwide pandemic ever!

Mass gatherings are against the rules, the reason why we have sport events cancelled & with no attendances

The R number is rising in some areas & these demonstrations are only going to increase virus infection elsewhere.

Our police force shouldn't have to put their lives in danger because of these mass gatherings

One police woman is in hospital with injuries this morning due to a few idiots causing her horse to bolt

User avatar
Chilli D
First Team
First Team
Posts: 1814
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:31 pm
Contact:

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Chilli D » Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:55 am

Sorry John, but as a President Donald Trump is a complete and utter moron.
Some of his comments and actions defy belief and are utterly embarrassing.
He's proved himself as a businessman and a businessman he should have stayed.

The George Floyd incident was shocking and looks to have created a worldwide tipping point and it seems to someone like me looking from afar that the US police force is awash with racism.
I also share 64's concerns regarding the mass protests in the midst of Corona virus.
Over here a lot of people are already acting like the pandemic never happened.

User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 81614
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by 1964white » Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:17 am

Chilli D wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:55 am

I also share 64's concerns regarding the mass protests in the midst of Corona virus.
Over here a lot of people are already acting like the pandemic never happened.
I despair with these crazy antics of the British society, common-sense gone completely out of the window

You only have to look at our beaches last week with 1000's thinking this pandemic is all over, mainly young people I may add :(

User avatar
gessa
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 23759
Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:40 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by gessa » Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:32 am

It's frightening to think Trump has got his finger on the button, but I would imagine and hope he could be talked out of it, as Nixon was during the cold war,
I could see his appeal to the mindset of a certain group of people but not enough to have got him elected, no matter how much he denies it,he is a racist and sexist and deep down I think he has Hitler type ideals of running a superpower that only the rich and beautiful are allowed with just a few subservients spared to do the dirty work. I see a lot of bands, a good few American ones and ever since he stood for election the majority bring him up sometime during the show" dont worry we won let him win" but he did , "sorry what our public have done to the rest of the world for voting him in" "he won't win again" 90% of what you read is against him and his values, so hopefully this will be the last we see of him.
One thing I've always disliked about America is and this applies to whoever is in the Whitehouse,they can't seem to keep their nose out of other countries business, which I could probably tolerate if their own house was in order but no matter how great a Country it is, there are many many problems in the USA, or rather there appears to be to this outsider.
:sick: :sick:

User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 81614
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by 1964white » Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:40 am

gessa wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:32 am
It's frightening to think Trump has got his finger on the button, but I would imagine and hope he could be talked out of it, as Nixon was during the cold war,
I could see his appeal to the mindset of a certain group of people but not enough to have got him elected, no matter how much he denies it,he is a racist and sexist and deep down I think he has Hitler type ideals of running a superpower that only the rich and beautiful are allowed with just a few subservients spared to do the dirty work. I see a lot of bands, a good few American ones and ever since he stood for election the majority bring him up sometime during the show" dont worry we won let him win" but he did , "sorry what our public have done to the rest of the world for voting him in" "he won't win again" 90% of what you read is against him and his values, so hopefully this will be the last we see of him.
One thing I've always disliked about America is and this applies to whoever is in the Whitehouse,they can't seem to keep their nose out of other countries business, which I could probably tolerate if their own house was in order but no matter how great a Country it is, there are many many problems in the USA, or rather there appears to be to this outsider.
Really sad that musicians have to be apologetic because of their hypocritical power-crazed leaders

American governments always looking for world supremacy mate, unfortunately other countries politicians follow like sheep

User avatar
Gandalf
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 9454
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:51 am

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Gandalf » Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:59 am

We have too many unfortunate similarities at the moment. We both have narcissist leaders who can lie effortlessly (although yours comes out with more downright disparaging statements). Both came to power on the back of orchestrated social media campaigns that targeted the leader of the opposition. Both have FPTP electoral systems rather than Proportional Representation which allows the party with fewer votes to win the election. Both have made a mess of the Pandemic when having a few weeks grace to see the correct course of action. Both have a poor opposition (although our new opposition leader shows promise). Luckily, on our side, we do still have free healthcare and very few guns.

I have been lucky to travel extensively across the US, and bar one or two occasions, I have found all Americans I have come across to be extremely courteous and generous. Those one or two occasions have been when I have been in contact with the US Police, who have been both surly and downright dangerous (to me). The protests have surprised me by their volume, but I cannot see a solution, any time soon, to the inherent problems, which are deep.
Delapsus Resurgam - When I fall I shall rise!

User avatar
lufc1304
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 8883
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 1:40 pm
Twitter: @DrGonzo2411
Location: Lisburn, N.I

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by lufc1304 » Sun Jun 07, 2020 12:03 pm

1964white wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:40 am
I fully understand the reasons for the protests, but......

We are going through the worst worldwide pandemic ever!

Mass gatherings are against the rules, the reason why we have sport events cancelled & with no attendances

The R number is rising in some areas & these demonstrations are only going to increase virus infection elsewhere.

Our police force shouldn't have to put their lives in danger because of these mass gatherings

One police woman is in hospital with injuries this morning due to a few idiots causing her horse to bolt
I agree with this, Leon, but that last sentence is inaccurate. If the woman you refer to is the one who hit a lamp post, then the reason she did so was that, rightly or wrongly, the mounted police were charging protestors, not that her horse had been spooked. My best mate's neighbour was there reporting on the protest and witnessed it. Again, I agree with the cause/sentiment but mass protests are utter madness in the current virus-riddled climate.
"When the going gets weird, the weird get professional!" Hunter S Thompson

User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 81614
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by 1964white » Sun Jun 07, 2020 12:20 pm

lufc1304 wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 12:03 pm
I agree with this, Leon, but that last sentence is inaccurate. If the woman you refer to is the one who hit a lamp post, then the reason she did so was that, rightly or wrongly, the mounted police were charging protestors, not that her horse had been spooked. My best mate's neighbour was there reporting on the protest and witnessed it. Again, I agree with the cause/sentiment but mass protests are utter madness in the current virus-riddled climate.
Mad all the same Nick

Clacton White
Reserve Player
Reserve Player
Posts: 437
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:56 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Clacton White » Sun Jun 07, 2020 12:20 pm

Chilli D wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:55 am
Sorry John, but as a President Donald Trump is a complete and utter moron.
Some of his comments and actions defy belief and are utterly embarrassing.
He's proved himself as a businessman and a businessman he should have stayed.

The George Floyd incident was shocking and looks to have created a worldwide tipping point and it seems to someone like me looking from afar that the US police force is awash with racism.
I also share 64's concerns regarding the mass protests in the midst of Corona virus.
Over here a lot of people are already acting like the pandemic never happened.
Yes , that's a worry . The virus is far from done , yet our moron is relaxing things , the message taken is that all is well now when it isn't . We are told to be alert , maybe not a serious enough message but everything is opening again soon.......to me wrong messages . People gathering on beaches , parks or protests- I guess Bomoron will blame these rather than his half baked messages . I hope I am wrong but everything points to a jump in virus cases again , so while USA has a problematic leader (home and abroad ) , we are by no means much better off either . I think here the lack of opposition in recent years hasn't helped at all , after all Boris has long been known as a clown , he just has the most important job to ply being a clown . These two are a big worry IMO .....Trump and Bomoron .

User avatar
LUFC_BOS
Youth Team
Youth Team
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 4:54 pm
Location: Boston , Massachusetts, USA

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by LUFC_BOS » Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:51 pm

John in Louisiana wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:29 pm
I'm very curious........

What impression do UK citizens ( or Aussies, Harry) have of what is going on in the USA these days?

I'm very much interested in knowing what the view looks like from across the pond.

I will not get offended by, or angry with, anything you have to say. I have friends from all across the political spectrum. I'm just really keen on knowing what we look like to the rest of the world right now.
John
We have seen a degradation in American ideals during the Trump administration. As you know, there is a divide in the country which has instigated deviseness , divide and conquer attitude. We have a Congress not willing to balance Presidential hubris (to put it a mildly). Inherent issues such as the original sin have been laid bare but when a father who participated in the million man march with MLK, now marches with his Son and granddaughter in Washington is indicative of the lack of progress. What other people's image of this America, is vastly different from those of the greatest generation as witnessed by the sacrifices made just 76 years ago yesterday.
I have lived and witnessed social strife in both UK 1980's riots and now in the US. The difference I see know , is that people who would have been bystanders before are now engaged and standing up to say enough. We wait for November to see if action will translate and moral outrage is just another 3 week fad.

Time will tell.

User avatar
Irish Ian
Manager
Manager
Posts: 4235
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:53 pm
Location: Directly above the centre of the Earth.

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Irish Ian » Sun Jun 07, 2020 8:14 pm

Hi John,

Most Americans I have met have come across as decent enough people.
Apart from the fact everyone seems ready to blow away anyone who gives them cause to.
But seriously.
It is the "Land of the Free, home of the Brave" type of crap that gets to me.

Truth and Justice are NOT American traits or National traits either, and why oh why when he is introduced is he always the President of THE UNITED STATES of AMERICA!

Does the American public need to be reminded where they bloody well live? Dont they know? :roflmao: It just sounds so, well, triumphalistic.

A few years ago I read Stone and Kusnicks Untold History of the United States and while I dont agree with all their analysis it was pretty enlightening read.
The US has succeeded in undermining governments right across this globe, including every one on the American Continent. They have forged an economic empire the greatest this world has ever seen, but just like the Roman Empire. It falls apart not through reversal oversees but through decadence at home.

So while Trump may have made it worse the racial and economic cracks have been there since the start.
Spike Lee made that point a few days ago.

You are screwed, just like everyone else.
'We can wait for the next game with serenity'

'I am quite clear in my mind that one has to feel sincere love for those he leads, and if he doesn't feel it naturally, then he must learn how to feel it' Marcelo Bielsa


'Would he kill his granny to win a match?' Bobby Collins

User avatar
Muppet the Cat
Manager
Manager
Posts: 4120
Joined: Mon May 29, 2017 9:42 pm
Location: Cardiff

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by Muppet the Cat » Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:01 pm

It appears to me that there is a huge political divide in the US at the moment and Trump appears to prosper in seeking to make that wider.

He seems to have no interest in helping those people who are seen as being on the outside of his core vote/supporters, as long as his supporters deliver enough votes to get him re-elected. I'm no expert on internal American politics, but the Democrats seem a fractured bunch and Trump has undoubtedly benefited from a weak opposition.

However, the same has been true in this country in recent years, whichever side has been in power. There just doesn't seem to be the calibre of politician around these days (be they in Government or opposition - prime recent/current examples being the likes of Diane Abbot and Priti Patel) that there used to be - whichever side of the political fence you sit.

Trump I'm sure has little genuine interest in doing what he can to secure meaningful change, so I don't see things radically changing with him in office.

What I'd be interested to get your take on John is how Trump's predecessor is viewed in terms of what he achieved in advancing racial inequalities in the US in his two terms in office.

It was a landmark moment (around the world) and especially in the US when Obama was elected and that must at least be an indication that issues of racial inequality had moved forward from the civil rights protests of the late 60s/70s, but not to the extent that they should for the vast majority. Surely, there were huge expectations that America's first black President could bring about meaningful social change for the America's black population. However, did things really change ?

People around the world (in the US ?) love Barack Obama (and seemingly even more so Michelle). He always seem calm, measured and eloquent. But did he really manage to move the inequality agenda forward, outside of his health care reforms, which Trump has probably now put a stop to.

My only experience of the US is trips to NYC, LA and Florida and on those occasions found the people we met warm and welcoming (albeit somewhat more brash in New York).

I think the whole world is getting more fu*ked up by the year John, it isn't just the US - albeit in many cases it's the US that has to a significant extent has caused the fu*k up in the first place. (I read a really interesting book last year called 'Prisoners of Geography, by Tim Marshall - it is well worth a read in helping you understand the world of global geopolitics. As you will expect the US features heavily).

User avatar
John in Louisiana
Manager
Manager
Posts: 4248
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:09 pm

Re: What Do You Think of Us?

Post by John in Louisiana » Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:06 pm

Thanks, all, for your thoughtful responses.

I won't presume to pass judgment on Boris.

From where I stand, Trump is absolutely the single most corrupt, venal, amoral, obtuse individual ever to hold the office he now occupies. He never reads, has zero intellectual curiosity, and is completely lacking in empathy. In other words, he is totally unfit*. That so many of my fellow Americans fail to see it is a source of great consternation. On top of that, while the US has suffered over the years from acting around the world as though other countries' opinions don't matter, Trump has raised contempt for the opinions of other nations - particularly our allies - to an art form.

That's where I stand, and I was interested in knowing whether the view from outside the country comported with mine, more or less. I appreciate your responses and your honesty.

* Trump tweeted 177 times on Friday. Literally. Even if we assume only four hours for sleep, that's about one tweet every six or seven minutes for the entire day. Given the fact that the country is falling apart, one would think he'd find something more productive to do with his time.

Post Reply

Advertisment