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Covid passports

Yes
20
45%
No
21
48%
Don't know
3
7%
 
Total votes: 44

Mountain
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Mountain »

Leeds1000 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 10:44 am Is the vaccine really going to stop transmission?
I don't know.

When I went for a hernia op, I don't know if the doctor was trying to cure me.

When my wife's mum went for cancer treatment, I didn't question it.

When my eldest daughter was born 6 weeks premature and spent days in neonatal, I didn't challenge her treatment.

Because I understand that I have no expertise in these areas, and I have to take the advice of my GP, the Consultants etc. And if I don't and the consequences are catastrophic, well I have taken that risk.
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1964white
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by 1964white »

Mick Jones shoulder wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 10:44 am Large leggings should be banned as it makes my eyes bad🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
:rol: :rol: :rol:
whiteroseboy
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by whiteroseboy »

Herd immunity hasn't worked in my view

The Swedish model of herd immunity.

Sweden has had just under 1500 deaths per 1 million and I'm sure some will quote ours is just under 1900.
However when you factor in the UKs population density which I believe allows viruses to spread easier(we are highest of all European countries with large populations). Only Monaco, Vatican City, Malta & San Marino are higher than England. Netherlands & Belgium are higher if you say UK (and the small European section of turkey).
So unless you think population density doesn't effect spread the Swedish herd immunity theory is flawed.

To be more accurate compare Swedens Herd immunity results with their close neighbours that followed lockdown rules.

Denmark less than 500 deaths per 1 million.
Finland less than 200 deaths per 1 million.
Norway less than 150 deaths per 1 million.

Swedens almost 1,500 deaths don't look a great success.

Oh and Brazil also went the herd immunity route and have well passed half a million deaths (over 2,500 per million).
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Leeds1000
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Leeds1000 »

Mountain wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 11:04 am I don't know.

When I went for a hernia op, I don't know if the doctor was trying to cure me.

When my wife's mum went for cancer treatment, I didn't question it.

When my eldest daughter was born 6 weeks premature and spent days in neonatal, I didn't challenge her treatment.

Because I understand that I have no expertise in these areas, and I have to take the advice of my GP, the Consultants etc. And if I don't and the consequences are catastrophic, well I have taken that risk.
You don't know. Thankyou for being honest! Something produced in record time, that as far as i can see has had very little impact of the confidence of anyone over 50 to live life normally again makes you wonder why doesn't it? And lets not forget the associated symptoms with the vaccines are in some cases greater than the risk of Covid. You take your chances i guess.
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Leeds1000
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Leeds1000 »

whiteroseboy wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 11:10 am Herd immunity hasn't worked in my view

The Swedish model of herd immunity.

Sweden has had just under 1500 deaths per 1 million and I'm sure some will quote ours is just under 1900.
However when you factor in the UKs population density which I believe allows viruses to spread easier(we are highest of all European countries with large populations). Only Monaco, Vatican City, Malta & San Marino are higher than England. Netherlands & Belgium are higher if you say UK (and the small European section of turkey).
So unless you think population density doesn't effect spread the Swedish herd immunity theory is flawed.

To be more accurate compare Swedens Herd immunity results with their close neighbours that followed lockdown rules.

Denmark less than 500 deaths per 1 million.
Finland less than 200 deaths per 1 million.
Norway less than 150 deaths per 1 million.

Swedens almost 1,500 deaths don't look a great success.

Oh and Brazil also went the herd immunity route and have well passed half a million deaths (over 2,500 per million).
We know a large proportion of deaths occurred in a care home setting. Sheltering the elderly and vulnerable from the start until the vaccines were available may have resulted in more immunity and less disruption and death? I haven't followed the Sweden for a while tbh but i heard someone say they don't wear masks in schools and if a child gets ill they just send the one child home not the entire class. Its looks like the pingdemic is the government passing the buck on lockdown.
Mountain
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Mountain »

Leeds1000 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 11:14 am You don't know. Thankyou for being honest! Something produced in record time...
Do you really know about the production time of vaccines.

Really?

What are your credentials in the area, maybe list the vaccines you have been involved in producing and the timelines. If you have written any papers in the area, better still. I don't know, so I'll bow to anyone who does, because all I see are spoofers who just google and cherry pick info and, most amusingly, don't even recognise that they don't know and they lack the expertise to assess and analyse the information in the area. It's all as useful as me standing with quantum physicists around the Hadron Collider and saying "you're doing it all wrong lads".
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by rab_rant »

I find it rather duplicitous that you post this photo as a warning that this can happen to people who don't get a vaccine, yet you have no sympathy for his demise. It is plainly an act of confirmation bias on your part. Posting things that agree with your point of view.

Regardless of the tragedy in his life and in the lives of his family this piece of writing could be construed as propaganda for vaccination, with references to him being a gentle giant, being full of regret and remorse. It tugs at our heartstrings and plays on our sympathies and acts as a warning. We are supposed to feel contrite and mend our foolish ways. We had better comply or this tragedy might happen to us. Fear mongering none less

Basically it is saying don't be foolish like this man get yourself vaccinated. Call me cynical but to make everyone feel compassion for this man's tragedy, and the heartache his family must feel, and at the same time be so dismissive of his death, reeks of twisted manipulation.

Let's now turn our attention to vaccine adverse event reporting system (vaers from the CDC)... something that deals in hardcore facts, let's talk blood clots,
myocarditis and pericarditis, let's talk cytokine storms, things that people who have taken the vaccine may have to deal with, now and in the future. We hardly ever hear that side of the story, and it is dismissed as fear mongering.

I wonder how all the vaccinated people would feel if there was continual reporting of vaccine adverse events, would it make them reconsider their choice, would there be videos saying I wish I had never taken the vaccine?

I have seen such traumatic videos but I would never think to post them on here, because of the sensitivities of those who have been vaccinated.


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Last edited by rab_rant on Thu Jul 22, 2021 12:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Leeds1000
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Leeds1000 »

Mountain wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 11:43 am Do you really know about the production time of vaccines.

Really?

What are your credentials in the area, maybe list the vaccines you have been involved in producing and the timelines. If you have written any papers in the area, better still. I don't know, so I'll bow to anyone who does, because all I see are spoofers who just google and cherry pick info and, most amusingly, don't even recognise that they don't know and they lack the expertise to assess and analyse the information in the area. It's all as useful as me standing with quantum physicists around the Hadron Collider and saying "you're doing it all wrong lads".
It was produced in record time its a well known fact isn't it?

https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/how-d ... gMQAvD_BwE

There is lots of stories about vaccine side effects and deaths occurring. I said it is a mindfield out there but are we supposed to just ignore the information that does eventually get released? Remember the 23 in Norway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Rfq53yj7Ho

It will be a few years yet before we can evaluate what's truly been going on and when people feel free to speak up/out.
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by rab_rant »

I have noticed that the title of this thread has been changed from passports, to the death of a man who didn't accept vaccination. Can we say that a certain narrative is being pushed here?

Just to be balanced, today I did the search for someone who has died because of the covid vaccination.

The report comes from Reuters and is cold and scientific and not emotive... and not a mention of a gentle giant anywhere... but let's dismiss it because it comes from the Ukraine, and therefore can't be reliable.

Ukraine investigates cause of man's death after COVID shot
Reuters

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Mick Jones shoulder
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Mick Jones shoulder »

I couldn't careless either way if I'm honest, but would you like to produce figures on deaths caused by the vaccines please..
While we are at it deaths caused by heart disease, obesity and cancer would be nice too.
By the way I'm vaccinated because I'd like to travel simple.
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1964white
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by 1964white »

rab_rant wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 12:12 pm I find it rather duplicitous that you post this video as a warning that this can happen to people who don't get a vaccine, yet you have no sympathy for his demise. It is plainly an act of confirmation bias on your part. Posting things that agree with your point of view.

Regardless of the tragedy in his life and in the lives of his family this piece of writing could be construed as propaganda for vaccination, with references to him being a gentle giant, being full of regret and remorse. It tugs at our heartstrings and plays on our sympathies and acts as a warning. We are supposed to feel contrite and mend our foolish ways. We had better comply or this tragedy might happen to us. Fear mongering none less

Basically it is saying don't be foolish like this man get yourself vaccinated. Call me cynical but to make everyone feel compassion for this man's tragedy, and the heartache his family must feel, and at the same time be so dismissive of his death, reeks of twisted manipulation.

Let's now turn our attention to vaccine adverse event reporting system (vaers from the CDC)... something that deals in hardcore facts, let's talk blood clots,
myocarditis and pericarditis, let's talk cytokine storms, things that people who have taken the vaccine may have to deal with, now and in the future. We hardly ever hear that side of the story, and it is dismissed as fear mongering.

I wonder how all the vaccinated people would feel if there was continual reporting of vaccine adverse events, would it make them reconsider their choice, would there be videos saying I wish I had never taken the vaccine?

I have seen such traumatic videos but I would never think to post them on here, because of the sensitivities of those who have been vaccinated.


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Firstly it wasn't a video it was a photo of the poor man who lost his life to covid which was featured on our local news.

The comments made came from his family, in particular his cousin.

Also on the national news this week there were two young men who fortunately were recovering after being on ventilators in hospital both insisting people should have their vaccine, one young man said he regrettably got lazy & decided not to bother with the jab.

I'm sorry but it's these type of people & those who are putting obstacles in the way that are holding up the vaccination process & prolonging this horrible pandemic.

Unfortunately our government are also guilty of so many errors with their irresponsible actions & unclear messages which has seen covid significantly increase over the last six weeks.

Btw, I'll probably be changing the title of this topic header to LOCKDOWN 4 in the next few weeks :(
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1964white
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by 1964white »

Mick Jones shoulder wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 3:40 pm I couldn't careless either way if I'm honest, but would you like to produce figures on deaths caused by the vaccines please..
While we are at it deaths caused by heart disease, obesity and cancer would be nice too.
By the way I'm vaccinated because I'd like to travel simple.
We never seem to get concrete daily/weekly figures on those illnesses or how old or young people are dying from covid MJ.

I feel really sorry for millions of people waiting for cancer/heart operations as this pandemic should have been more or less resolved by now.
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Smudge3920
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Smudge3920 »

1964white wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 4:06 pm We never seem to get concrete figures on those illnesses or how old or young people are dying from covid MJ.

I feel really sorry for millions of people waiting for cancer/heart operations as this pandemic should have been more or less resolved by now.
The surgery I have been waiting for for over a year has been cancelled twice now , waiting for my 3rd appointment , maybe 3rd time lucky we will see :)
.........
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1964white
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by 1964white »

Smudge3920 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 4:40 pm The surgery I have been waiting for for over a year has been cancelled twice now , waiting for my 3rd appointment , maybe 3rd time lucky we will see :)
.........
Good luck Smudge.
Norm
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Norm »

One thing I think could have happened with the Swedish approach - not that I'm claiming any expertise or knowledge - is that with their open approach, most of their population may have been exposed to the virus and their future death rate may come down as the natural process plays out.

I admit I have no facts on whether my hypothesis is correct, but I'm just trying to think logically of the possibility that what I have said could be true. :dun:
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by The Subhuman »

We have a pingdemic at the moment and that's reflected in empty supermarket shelves. Lorry drivers are getting told to isolate leaving thousands of man hour less available and transport companies are trying to fil the void

I think it's either or, if you want to open up the country again while risking an escalating outbreak then you have to forego the isolation.
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

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Norm wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 5:00 pm One thing I think could have happened with the Swedish approach - not that I'm claiming any expertise or knowledge - is that with their open approach, most of their population may have been exposed to the virus and their future death rate may come down as the natural process plays out.

I admit I have no facts on whether my hypothesis is correct, but I'm just trying to think logically of the possibility that what I have said could be true. :dun:
As you say it's way too early to come to any conclusion. This probably takes years to play out. One of my favourite historian quotes is when asked the socio economic effects of the Napoleonic War a respected historian in around 1985 said it was way too soon to tell
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by whiteroseboy »

1964white wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 4:06 pm We never seem to get concrete daily/weekly figures on those illnesses or how old or young people are dying from covid MJ.

I feel really sorry for millions of people waiting for cancer/heart operations as this pandemic should have been more or less resolved by now.


Figures for cancer vary dependant on the Cancer some are over 90% mortality others much less so but you need to factor in how early they are discovered.
Treatments are improving but certainly no vaccine.

Heart disease (along with some cancers) are hereditary so difficult to avoid but good diet and healthy life style can prolong them.
I'm actually a believer that progress in medicine should be DNA based, eg, a persons DNA should be taken at birth and it should be possible what potential disease the person may suffer and in turn the person should know what food, etc is good and bad for them.then their life choices is known from a early age.

Obesity is a major issue and should be dealt with, a succession of governments (along with poor parenting) around the world are to blame in my view, the western world is getting soft and lazy. You've only got to look at any school to see we are a ticking time bomb. Of course Obesity plays its part in many illnesses including Cancer & heart issues.

But saying all that sadly their isn't a vaccine for any of these so its a different issue to the Covid one.

The fact their was 80,000 more deaths in the UK (all causes) in 2020 than the previous 5 years average suggests something is causing it. To me its clear what it is and that is why the vaccine made sense for me.
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by Mick Jones shoulder »

Could you imagine taking dna at birth and all the complications you would encounter from the liberal masses not wanting to be traced🤣🤣 personally I'd go for it, be brilliant for crime prevention and reasons you put forward but I'm sure the the conspiracy theorists would pour cold water on that one.
Are you suggesting that people are incapable of self restraint when it comes to food. The vaccine for obesity is common sense and exercise period. We will be discussing poverty in the uk next, poverty for me is walking 12 miles to get water that isn't fit to to drink not managing to get up the shop for your tobacco.
Being raised on a council estate I think I'm reasonably qualified on this one🤔
Bad parenting but that's just monkey see monkey do and will only get progressively worse..
Pandemics once in a 100 year occurrences and as difficult as it may sound a culling of the population is just nature's way. Could be anyone of us popping off this mortal coil. That was cheerful 🤣🤣🤣
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Re: Man loses his life after refusing the vaccine jabs.

Post by rab_rant »

Deleted the deCode article for there is no sense in debate. Minds are already made up.

wish you well with the choices you make
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