The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) - Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

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Breakfast Debate The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) - Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Ellandback1 »



Good Morning. It's Wednesday 7th April, and here are the latest headlines from Elland Road...


Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

On Phil Hay's latest podcast, the Leeds Utd journalist was trying to dissect why only half the Leeds fans who completed the online Athletic survey were happy with their performances on the field this season. When people were asked if they were happy with the Leeds performance this year it came in at 54.83% which is pretty low for a promoted club who have played the way they’ve played and are mid-table and are definitely staying up. Hay said...

I can only assume that in the main, 100% of people are happy or satisfied, but the reason it’s dropped to 50% must be because people have issues with the amount of goals conceded, the problems at set-pieces, or other little things that are niggling at them and turning them into perfectionists.

I’m very, very surprised it’s not in the 80%s or 90%s, I find it difficult to imagine they can pick much wrong with this squad. I think Bielsa has got everything he can from these players. I know we could pick at set-pieces but this is a side that’s come out of the Championship and performed really well.

Leeds have conceded 48 times this season so far. When you're paying a Manager 6m a year, you expect him to learn by his mistakes. Yes, Bielsa got us into the Premier league, and we are are more or less guaranteed a mid table finish; BUT the Argentine has spent an unprecedented amount in the last couple of seasons.

Far lessor players have conceded only a fraction of goals from set pieces compared to the Whites. Why? They find a way to make it difficult for the opponents. Why hasn't Bielsa learnt by his mistakes? What would happen to you, if you were to make the same mistake again and again at work? It's still the honeymoon period for Bielsa at the moment. I'm wondering if this does not change next season, will Leeds fans be so forgiving?





Who will replace Harrison?

With Jack Harrison illegible to play against his parent club, who should replace him in the starting line up on Saturday lunchtime? The logical choice would be Helder Costa. The 27yo has made ten starts for the Whites this term and nine substitute appearances. He has netted three times and contributed with three assists. His Whoscored rating is just 6.31, leaving the Angolan in 17th place in the Leeds rankings.

Alioski joined Leeds four years ago as a left sided winger. However its fair to say, he could put in a shift anywhere on the field and he would do an okay job! Crysencio Summerville has been in outstanding form for Mark Jackson' U23's. He's exciting, quick, bags of talent and has an eye for goal. Is a first team debut against the Champions to be, too much of a step up for the 19 year old?

Ian Povada must be in for a shout to play against his former club. Although predominantly right sided, when on form the 21 year old can be outstanding. Maybe Bielsa will decide to play three centre backs now that Koch is fit, and use either Dallas or Alioski as wing backs? What would you do?





Worse Leeds signings

Yesterday, you were asked who Leeds 5 best signings were. Today, we are going to look at the top 10 worse signings, whether permanent or on loan!


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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Mountain »

Ellandback1 wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:34 am What would happen to you, if you were to make the same mistake again and again at work?
If I introduced a system that had my employer enjoying success not seen in 2 decades (with much the same staff) but that system did produce some errors, and my employer was moaning about the errors, I'd probably tell him I could always take my work and system elsewhere.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by hector »

Why have we got a photo of Prince Nonce at the bottom??

;-) :duno:
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Ellandback1 »

Mountain wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:54 am If I introduced a system that had my employer enjoying success not seen in 2 decades (with much the same staff) but that system did produce some errors, and my employer was moaning about the errors, I'd probably tell him I could always take my work and system elsewhere.
But he is being paid 6m to do so.

He has spent 100 last Summer.

He spent more last season than any other Championship club by a Country mile....

Its not 'some errors, these are things that lessor teams with much smaller budgets have mastered
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Ellandback1 »

Worse signings.

Ruchubka

Hunt

Paynter

Kebe

Cameron Stewart
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by hector »

not Brolin??
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by DDB220 »

How crazy is it that some fans are not content with Bielsa. Short memories and over expectation.
The whole ethos of the club has changed, what he has done is not just about the team, it is the whole club. We were in complete disarray 3 years ago.
Maybe some of the signings haven’t met expectations but that is the nature of the game, there are no certs.
He has me scratching my head on occasion with selections but that is the nature of the armchair manager, always assuming they know best.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by HarryofOz »

First of all seeing that our defending has improved so how anyone can say that we haven't learnt from our mistakes beggars belief.

Secondly comparing Bielsa or any Leeds player or any footballer or any sportsperson's job to a other types of jobs is simply ridiculous.

In other jobs it is simply (for the most part) a case of learning from your mistakes. You do not have a situation like you do in football (or any sport) where an opponent is trying to make you make mistakes or to outperform you on a one-on-one basis. There is no comparison to working in an office or running a bank or waiting on tables, or building bridges or designing buildings or fishing for herring or treating people medically or controlling traffic or driving a bus and playing sport. The circumstances are completely totally and utterly different.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Byebyegeegee »

It seems to me that conceding goals from crosses and set pieces is a symptom of Bielsaball. Bielsa likes his central defenders to be mobile, quick and comfortable with the ball at their feet which tends to make them not quite as physically strong (or even perhaps as tall) compared to other teams central defenders. But as a consequence I suspect that when/if the cross is dealt with we have a far better chance of a quick and effective counter attack than most other teams, which is possibly the pay off for Bielsa.

I’m pretty sure Bielsa will start with Costa in place of Harrison but may bring Poveda on for 20 minutes or so, he’ll be itching to show what he can do against his old club.

Blimey worst transfers - there have been so many over the years, mainly from Ridsdale onwards but quite a few before that that I wouldn’t know where to start.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by CHAPELALLMAN »

HarryofOz wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:26 am First of all seeing that our defending has improved so how anyone can say that we haven't learnt from our mistakes beggars belief.

Secondly comparing Bielsa or any Leeds player or any footballer or any sportsperson's job to a other types of jobs is simply ridiculous.

In other jobs it is simply (for the most part) a case of learning from your mistakes. You do not have a situation like you do in football (or any sport) where an opponent is trying to make you make mistakes or to outperform you on a one-on-one basis. There is no comparison to working in an office or running a bank or waiting on tables, or building bridges or designing buildings or fishing for herring or treating people medically or controlling traffic or driving a bus and playing sport. The circumstances are completely totally and utterly different.
The whole of the business world is based on competition and survival of the fittest Harry. Maybe some in the public sector ( with the exception obviously of the NHS ) can sit back on decent salaries and little pressure, but the lifeblood of the UK economy revolves around small and medium size businesses who have to fight and compete to survive - especially at the moment.

Football is a business too - with astronomical salaries at stake for those involved. A PL footballer is set up for life after 2 or 3 seasons. In the case of Casilla he earns about 80 times what the average UK worker earns in a week.... :roll:
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by CHAPELALLMAN »

Byebyegeegee wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:26 am It seems to me that conceding goals from crosses and set pieces is a symptom of Bielsaball. Bielsa likes his central defenders to be mobile, quick and comfortable with the ball at their feet which tends to make them not quite as physically strong (or even perhaps as tall) compared to other teams central defenders. But as a consequence I suspect that when/if the cross is dealt with we have a far better chance of a quick and effective counter attack than most other teams, which is possibly the pay off for Bielsa.

I’m pretty sure Bielsa will start with Costa in place of Harrison but may bring Poveda on for 20 minutes or so, he’ll be itching to show what he can do against his old club.

Blimey worst transfers - there have been so many over the years, mainly from Ridsdale onwards but quite a few before that that I wouldn’t know where to start.
I suspect that it's the man marking - you can't watch watch the flight of the ball from a corner and then position yourself and jump if you are rooted to the spot with one eye on the player you are marking, and probably jostling/grappling with him at the same time.

That goal conceded against Fulham was a good example of that - Ayling was totally preoccupied with marking his man ( who deliberately stood behind him until the last moment ) with a huge space to his side of about 4m with no players in it - the ball was at the right height to clear with a header in that space. A gaggle of players on the other side of the gap all missed the ball as it soared way over their heads. When it came to Ayling the ball was at ankle height, but he had only focused on marking his man, not on meeting the flight of the ball.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by HarryofOz »

CHAPELALLMAN wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:40 am The whole of the business world is based on competition and survival of the fittest Harry. Maybe some in the public sector ( with the exception obviously of the NHS ) can sit back on decent salaries and little pressure, but the lifeblood of the UK economy revolves around small and medium size businesses who have to fight and compete to survive - especially at the moment.

Football is a business too - with astronomical salaries at stake for those involved. A PL footballer is set up for life after 2 or 3 seasons. In the case of Casilla he earns about 80 times what the average UK worker earns in a week.... :roll:
There is a difference between competition and interference. Two restaurants may compete for customers through offers and advertising but the employees of restaurant A do not turn up at restaurant B and stop them from serving their customers.

That is what happens on a football pitch. Not only does each team try do their job but they physically try stop the other team from doing theirs.

This is not about whether Bielsa can or should be doing better but its not as simple as saying that if I kept making a mistake in my job I'd lose it and the same should apply to Bielsa. Our situations are completely different.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

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Mountain wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:54 am If I introduced a system that had my employer enjoying success not seen in 2 decades (with much the same staff) but that system did produce some errors, and my employer was moaning about the errors, I'd probably tell him I could always take my work and system elsewhere.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by rab_rant »

We should not forget that some teams are better at set pieces than others.

 Manchester City have the fourth best chance conversion rate from dead ball situations, scoring a quarter of the chances they get. Their rate of 25% is the best in the Premier League.

Whereas if you look at Villa they have just 4.1% of 48 chances.

It is a mistake to think that all teams are efficient in deadball situations. The more skillful ones will score goals regardless of how the defense has been organized.

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Smudge3920 »

IMO the only area that needs to be changed is the man to man marking system, switch to zonal...That said in the last 15 games our defensive cover has improved by leaps and bounds, so we have learned... I am assuming that the man to man marking MB goes with is integral to the whole system, it is beyond me but I certainly would not question someone of MB's stature in the game... As for those who are not happy with this years performance how can you not be?...there is no base line at this level... if we do not improve next season, then start bitching is all I can say.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Ratscoot »

Morning EB et all

I tend to agree that playing the Bielsa way means our CBs aren't as big or physical as most and I love the fact our CBs can run with the ball, go past players, pass the ball to feet or 40 yard cross field passes but sometimes I do miss the CB that can clatter someone, be stronger than the opposition and win headers and I do scream at the TV why didn't you put him and/or the ball in row Z but then I watch as our CB starts off the attacking move or turns the forward inside out with a turn and deep down I know Bielsa is right.

Worst player there's been so many :lol:

As said earlier the likes of Ruchubka, Kebe, Paynter but one I truly dislike is Cameron Stewart who was only in it for the money, I genuinely believe there was a player in there but he just couldn't be arsed and for me that's unforgivable as I'd have given anything to play for Leeds
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by 1964white »

DDB220 wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:16 am How crazy is it that some fans are not content with Bielsa. Short memories and over expectation.
The whole ethos of the club has changed, what he has done is not just about the team, it is the whole club. We were in complete disarray 3 years ago.
Maybe some of the signings haven’t met expectations but that is the nature of the game, there are no certs.
He has me scratching my head on occasion with selections but that is the nature of the armchair manager, always assuming they know best.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Chilli D »

Ratscoot wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:23 am Morning EB et all

I tend to agree that playing the Bielsa way means our CBs aren't as big or physical as most and I love the fact our CBs can run with the ball, go past players, pass the ball to feet or 40 yard cross field passes but sometimes I do miss the CB that can clatter someone, be stronger than the opposition and win headers and I do scream at the TV why didn't you put him and/or the ball in row Z but then I watch as our CB starts off the attacking move or turns the forward inside out with a turn and deep down I know Bielsa is right.

Worst player there's been so many :lol:

As said earlier the likes of Ruchubka, Kebe, Paynter but one I truly dislike is Cameron Stewart who was only in it for the money, I genuinely believe there was a player in there but he just couldn't be arsed and for me that's unforgivable as I'd have given anything to play for Leeds
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by HarryofOz »

We have signed so many players that I can't remember a small fraction of them.

But vague memory - and I could still be wrong - but wasn't there someone who signed for us and the left within a ridiculously short period. I think it may have been during the Wise era.

And I seem to remember someone signing and basically not trying because he didn't really want to sign in the first place. Or he just asked to leave when things didn't go well - wanted to go back to his previous club. Name escapes me.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 7th April) Hay amazed at amount of unhappy Leeds fans

Post by Leeds1000 »

I said it a few weeks back, Marcello could do alot worse than to have a look at how MC have turned it around defensively, they play with the same principles albeit with better players.

I think if you asked 99.9% of Leeds fans they would say they are satisfied with our first season back in the PL, but like anything in life there is always room for improvement and set-pieces would be first on that list. I guess like City it may come as a cost of some of the maverick football we have witnessed and end up a more solid methodical set-up? Its definitely improved since Dallas moved back into help Phillips out.

Then there's the result against MU will live long in the minds of some fans and rightly so it was an embarrassment. On a whole tho and its been said a million times, AR has come in and done what he said he would, he's managed to convince one of the best coaches in the world to revive our ailing fortunes down in the 2nd tier of English football, get us playing football that most of us didn't think this set of players were capable of and now in the PL we are getting plaudits from every man and his dog for our style of play.

Since Marcello walked thru the doors its been Roy of the Rovers stuff really. All the wannabe past owners not really having a pot to piss in. People like Bates dragging the club thru the mud to save it and no one really knowing who owned the club in the Cayman Islands of wherever it was.

We are not out of the woods yet tho, that second tricky season in the PL, will MB stay or go back home? I think we need afew solid seasons in the PL just to see where the club really are in terms of finance going forward. Its been a great start back in the PL but you feel there will be plenty more ups and a a few downs in the next few seasons.
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