Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Ellandback1
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Match Thread Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Saturday 25th September 15:00 | Elland Road


Less than 72 hours after beating Manchester United in the League Cup, David Moyes' West Ham travel to Elland Road as Leeds search for their first three points of the season. Leeds injury crises worsened after it was revealed on the club's website that Patrick Bamford did not participate in Tuesday's win over Fulham due to an ankle injury he sustained at St James Park last weekend. He is joined by Luke Ayling, Diego Llorente and Robin Koch whilst fellow centre back Pascal Struijk serves his final suspension. Jack Harrison is also recovering from Covid and makes the bench.

Skipper Liam Cooper will return to his defensive duties after being rested midweek. Kelvin Phillips took on the responsibility at Craven Cottage, but the England ace will return to midfield for Saturday's clash. Cooper will be joined in defence by Charlie Cresswell who stepped up against Fulham with an impressive performance. With Bamford out, Rodrigo will get a chance up front and will look to impress in his favoured position. Jamie Shackleton will start at right back where he ended the Fulham clash with Stuart Dallas moving to midfield alongside Mateusz Klich.




West Ham full-back Ryan Fredericks misses out with a groin problem. Fredericks suffered the injury early on during the midweek cup win at Manchester United and needs a scan to assess the extent of the damage. Michail Antonio returns in attack after being rested on Wednesday along with Lukasz Fabianski, Kurt Zouma, Declan Rice, Thomas Soucek and Said Benrahma. Antonio is the Premier League's top scorer with 4 goals in 4 games so far. He will certainly be a handfull for the young Charlie Cresswell.

Last season West Ham took the points on both occasions with a 2-1 victory at Elland Road in December and a 2-0 victory in the return fixture at the London Stadium in March. Leeds are without a win in the league so far this season, and a victory today against a team who did the double over them last season would be a real confidence boost. This will be the 101st time the sides have faced each other in the League. Leeds have come out on top 47 times, West Ham have been victors 26 times and the points have been shared 27 times.


Leeds Starting XI
Meslier, Shackleton, Cresswell, Cooper, Firpo, Phillips, Raphinha, Klich, Dallas, James, Rodrigo

Suss: Roberts, Klaesson, Harrison, Gelhardt, Hjelde, Drameh, Summerville, Greenwood, McCarron
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

Post by 1964white »

Watching the hammers creating so many chances & beating Manure with their 2nd XI is a scary prospect for our game on Saturday.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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This is a concerning match up for us.

Strong at our Achilles Heel, set pieces, good out wide with Bowen and Benrahma (players who have taken us apart before), and Antonio will really fancy his chances against Cooper. I’d take a point right now.

Watford is the one I’d be really worried about if we lose that.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Can't see us getting anything out of this game.

Why on earth do we not have a back up for Bamford?
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 8:42 am This is a concerning match up for us.

Strong at our Achilles Heel, set pieces, good out wide with Bowen and Benrahma (players who have taken us apart before), and Antonio will really fancy his chances against Cooper. I’d take a point right now.

Watford is the one I’d be really worried about if we lose that.
I'd take a point as well even though it would mean only 4 from 18.
Can't believe we are only 6 games in and we have an injury crisis.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Chilli D wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:19 am I'd take a point as well even though it would mean only 4 from 18.
Can't believe we are only 6 games in and we have an injury crisis.
I can Chilli, it was the same last season :(
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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No matter who is at the back and in our midfield we need to do better. We have been shocking defensively even with Llorente, the amount of chances we have given to the opposition are far too many. And before anyone chimes in with "it is just a consequence of how we play" that is rubbish, you can still hold a decent defensive shape.

It needs to improve big time.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Llorente, Koch and Bamford not available.

Bielsa not prepared to comment on Raphinha, Harrison & Ayling's chances of playing.

"We have enough players. Prepared to adapt to the circumstances"

No we haven't, Marcelo.

I've never said this under Bielsa's management. but I'm expecting a battering :(
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Dennis Beercamp here football philosopher extraordinaire with an insight into the logic of how Marcelo Bieslsa picks his team🤪😜

Bielsa is a firm believer in using Occam's razor in his team selection. Put in simple terms simplify your choices and you have less variables to deal with. This makes the permutation of all possibilities a much simpler process.

Called Ockam's razor (more commonly spelled Occam's razor), advises you to seek the more economical solution: In layman's terms, the simplest choices are usually the best ones. Occam's razor is often stated as an injunction not to make more assumptions than you absolutely need.

This is why he prefers a small team of 18 players to choose from. if the team selection was to be made from 30 players then the permutations would be much more complicated

ideally he would like to choose a team from 11 players since then no computation is needed since there is only one selection available.

simplifying the team selection process is paramount.. injuries and suspensions make the task so much simpler, since those choices are not available.

By applying Occam's razor this takes a lot of the headache out of team selection away from the manager which is a great relief... and the players in a small team are less stressed since they know they are more likely to be picked.
Last edited by rab_rant on Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:22 pm Llorente, Koch and Bamford not available.

Bielsa not prepared to comment on Raphinha, Harrison & Ayling's chances of playing.

"We have enough players. Prepared to adapt to the circumstances"

No we haven't, Marcelo.

I've never said this under Bielsa's management. but I'm expecting a battering :(
I expect we will be in trouble.

Down to the bare bones already
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:38 am I can Chilli, it was the same last season :(
Was just gonna say the same. Ridiculous situation really
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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rab_rant wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:35 pm Dennis Beercamp here football philosopher extraordinaire with an insight into the logic of how Marcelo Bieslsa picks his team🤪😜

Bielsa is a firm believer in using Occam's razor in his team selection. Put in simple terms simplify your choices and you have less variables to deal with. This makes the permutation of all possibilities a much simpler process.

Called Ockam's razor (more commonly spelled Occam's razor), advises you to seek the more economical solution: In layman's terms, the simplest choices are usually the best ones. Occam's razor is often stated as an injunction not to make more assumptions than you absolutely need.

This is why he prefers a small team of 18 players to choose from. if the team selection was to be made from 30 players then the permutations would be much more complicated

ideally he would like to choose a team from 11 players since then no computation is needed since there is only one selection available.

simplifying the team selection process is paramount.. injuries and suspensions make the task so much simpler, since those choices are not available.

By applying Occam's razor this takes a lot of the headache out of team selection away from the manager which is a great relief... and the players in a small team are less stressed since they know they are more likely to be picked.
Workable if you have a quality eighteen man squad & you don't have so many players constantly unavailable.

Imo, applying Occam's razor is a way of cutting your own throat :(
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:12 pm Workable if you have a quality eighteen man squad & you don't have so many players constantly unavailable.

Imo, applying Occam's razor is a way of cutting your own throat :(
:lol: That would be funny.... if it wasn't true
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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square pegs into round holes time again for Bielsa reason being small squad he likes a small squad. ridiculous
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Ellandback1 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:11 am
Why on earth do we not have a back up for Bamford?
Because when the shops were open no one was interested since everyone was still preening themselves over Bambi’s first season scoring record and nobody gave a thought to what would happen a) if he dried up, or b) he got crocked.
Guess what (a+b) = doodoo
I reserve the right to be wrong
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Time for Rodrigo to shine in his favoured position.

:soccer: :spa: :soccer: :spa:
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 8:42 am This is a concerning match up for us.

Strong at our Achilles Heel, set pieces, good out wide with Bowen and Benrahma (players who have taken us apart before), and Antonio will really fancy his chances against Cooper. I’d take a point right now.

Watford is the one I’d be really worried about if we lose that.
I think you've morphed into me :lol:
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Cjay wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:00 pm I expect we will be in trouble.

Down to the bare bones already
That's how MB operates. This is the small squad syndrome and with an over reliance on Bamford, with no adequate back up. We have Rodrigo who's rarely impressed as well as being played ineffe tively as a CM. Another worry is the form of Firpo, he is struggling to adjust to PL and even getting the basics right at the moment. This will be another area West Ham will be seeking to exploit.

That said, we'll probably come away with a win.
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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1964white wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:12 pm Workable if you have a quality eighteen man squad & you don't have so many players constantly unavailable.

Imo, applying Occam's razor is a way of cutting your own throat :(
I hope you realize that my tongue was firmly in my cheek when I was writing that piece.

team selection does get easier if you have fewer players, but the main question is the quality of those players. I expect there are metrics for each and every Leeds player, and choices have to be made accordingly, to select the best possible team.

not an easy task with so many injuries and suspensions
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Re: Leeds Utd v West Ham Utd Match Thread

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Orange Box wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:56 pm Because when the shops were open no one was interested since everyone was still preening themselves over Bambi’s first season scoring record and nobody gave a thought to what would happen a) if he dried up, or b) he got crocked.
Guess what (a+b) = doodoo
Short-sighted mentality.
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