The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 15th April) - Has Farke Finally Done Enough to Silence the Doubters?

[Ellandback1]

Good Morning. It's Wednesday 15th April, and here are the latest headlines from Elland Road...


Has Farke Finally Done Enough to Silence the Doubters?

With Leeds United's top-flight status all but secured, the most pressing question lingering in the air is whether Daniel Farke has done enough to prove his doubters wrong?

It's a question that's followed him since promotion was confirmed last spring, when the national press were already running stories suggesting the 49ers were weighing up a change and that scepticism didn't come from nowhere. In 49 Premier League games with Norwich, Farke won just six, a win percentage of 12.2%, the worst of any manager to take charge of more than 43 games in the competition's history. When Leeds slipped into the bottom three earlier this season, the vultures circled fast. It felt horribly familiar.

But Farke didn't fold, he adapted, changed his style and his system. The definitive proof came on Monday night at Old Trafford, where instead of parking the bus, he pushed a high line, pressed aggressively, and showed a level of tactical bravery that was frankly brilliant to watch. He was handed a clear mandate at the start of the season, bank a point a game, and he is on course to surpass that. Throw in an FA Cup Semi Final and surely he is on track to exceed anyone’s expectations this season.

There will be speculation again this summer, that's just Leeds United, the noise never stops. But after pulling off an act of defiance that few thought possible, with every player clearly running through walls for him, why on earth would they gamble on change? The Norwich record has defined him for too long, has he now proved his doubters wrong?





Carrick rips into officials following loss

Michael Carrick was left seething after Manchester Utd's home loss to the mighty Leeds on Monday evening. The interim head coach looked like a man who’d seen enough of Paul Tierney and the VAR crew, letting rip at the officiating after a string of calls went south for Manchester United. The big talking point was Lisandro Martinez getting his marching orders for pulling Dominic Calvert-Lewin’s hair, a decision Carrick labelled "shocking." To him, it was a soft graze, a mere "touch of the hair" that somehow turned into a red card once the VAR cameras slowed it down.

But the frustration started long before the red card. Carrick was still reeling over Noah Okafor’s opening goal, where he felt Leny Yoro was "smashed" in the back of the head by Calvert-Lewin in the build-up. "I don’t know how that doesn’t get overturned," Carrick vented, gesturing wildly to show how Yoro was shoved. For a club like Manchester Utd, who, let’s be honest, have enjoyed the lion's share of favourable decisions since the 90s, having the whistle go against them felt like a personal insult. While the PGMOL might argue they were just following the letter of the law, for Carrick, it felt like his side was fighting both the opposition and the rulebook at the same time.

[Orange Box]

I ask myself - “did a single scum player call for a foul? Did Yoro complain? What about the perennial whinger, Ferenandes? Did he sprint 50 yards to get in the ref’s ear?”

My answer - no.

Move on, son. Take one on the chin.

[Clitheroe White]

Is DF overcoming the doubters - Yes, undoubtedly

Carrick grumbling about officials - welcome to the club. It was nice to not be on the receiving end for a change.

[Tom the Cat]

Carrick is a whinging, whining prat. I don't suppose that he can remember from his playing days that the Scum got every 50/50 decision and were often awarded dodgy penalties in the last few minutes of matches they were not winning - also the excessive periods of added time when they were not winning. I am afraid that Carrick's comments have made him look very foolish - all he had to say was "We were poor, Leeds played well and deserved to win" and he would have come out well. I wonder if the PL will hammer him for daring to criticise the match officials but I am not holding my beath !!

[1964white]

Carrick is a whinging, whining prat. I don't suppose that he can remember from his playing days that the Scum got every 50/50 decision and were often awarded dodgy penalties in the last few minutes of matches they were not winning - also the excessive periods of added time when they were not winning. I am afraid that Carrick's comments have made him look very foolish - all he had to say was "We were poor, Leeds played well and deserved to win" and he would have come out well. I wonder if the PL will hammer him for daring to criticise the match officials but I am not holding my beath !!

My sentiments too, Tom.

[The Subhuman]

Depends what the doubts are surely ?

[GreennWhite]

I doubt Farke will have done enough for some fans. Once they get it into their heads he isnt a good manager then that will never change. But thankfully the majority of fans can see what he is actually doing/done and they will be happy with that.....BUT......there always is a but
He still has not got us over the line yet, and thats what he will be judged on. Regardless of his very good record in the Championship its this season that really counts for him.
As for Elland`s comment that Leeds have all but secured their place in the league this season

[DDB220]

End of the season question as to whether the doubters are less doubtful.

There are still many possibilities regarding outcomes this season.

[WhiteRose]

You can never silence doubt especially in a game as changeable as football - I’m overall happy with Farke and I’d have him up there with Bielsa if we survive but that doesn’t mean he is beyond criticism- let’s see what happens on Saturday, we know we can find performances against the better teams it’s the shitter ones we sometimes struggle to put away.

[Finnatic]

I ask myself - “did a single scum player call for a foul? Did Yoro complain? What about the perennial whinger, Ferenandes? Did he sprint 50 yards to get in the ref’s ear?”

My answer - no.

Move on, son. Take one on the chin.

Roy Keane said it was nothing too, when the presenter mentioned the ‘incident’.

[ruttermania]

Perhaps Martinez could claim that he was being improperly coached as his Manager clearly failed to keep himself up to date with current guidance on the referees interpretation of the game ? Most of the 'debate' being conducted on the scum side of the media entirely ignores the context of what has happened over the last couple of seasons .Because of the various controversies which occurred Refs have been instructed that any form of hairpulling is to be considered as prima facie a deemed offence of violent conduct. There may be exceptional circumstances where on a review there are extenuating circumstances which reduce the offence but none of them exist in a situation where the offender makes two grabs for the hair , clearly yanks back DCL's head and dislodges the yokey tying it up. As alleged tactical genius Carrick clearly doesn't understand this simple message to communicate to his players 'don't pull hair' it's scarcely surprising that Martinez was bewildered .

[Sean_Nile]

I ask myself - “did a single scum player call for a foul? Did Yoro complain? What about the perennial whinger, Ferenandes? Did he sprint 50 yards to get in the ref’s ear?”

My answer - no.

Move on, son. Take one on the chin.

“Yes, I touched his hair,” protested Martínez, voice trembling with theatrical injustice, “but only to verify its structural integrity. Player safety. Very important.”

I was only wondering if he had used Head and shoulder shampoo... such fine head of hair... jealous I was, and I get punnished for this? ah carumba, mamma mia

[Irish Ian]

Farke has established his credentials as a good manager.

Fans will always have doubts about any particular setup at their club.

Doubts are ok, I just believe that if you go looking for things to worry about you will find them and once you have your theory will then go looking for reasons to double down on them.

While doubts are part and parcel of being a fan, unfair criticism of things you have no real insight into is just foolish.

I read a fair bit of that on here and while it is sacrosanct because it is opinion, it doesn't mean it is in any way credible.

Has he won me over?
He didn't need to, his credentials as a manager were well established before he arrived.
He helped us promote albeit one season after we would have liked and that has meant we lost Rutter etc.

Does that mean I believed he would keep us up?

I didn't, but not because of Farkes ability I didn't think we had enough tools in the box to do the job pre season.


Truth be told he has become a massive positive influence on the club and if he is given the right tools could help Leeds avoid becoming a yoyo club in the future.

[Ellandback1]

[John in Louisiana]

Farke has shown, more than anything else this year, an ability to learn from past mistakes. I felt from the beginning that his past experiences with Norwich, rather than being an indication that he was not competent to succeed in the EPL, would provide him with lessons he could learn to assure our survival. He filled the squad with the sort of players he thought would survive. It's a much more physical squad than last year's. Even Aaronson got the message. He could still stand to toughen up some, but he's a lot stronger and more physical than in the past.

And when his Plan A failed in the first few months, he learned his lesson and found a plan B that has succeeded.

We are not out of the woods yet. Six points seems like a healthy cushion, but it can disappear in a week. Still think Spurs have too much talent not to win a few before the end and West Ham and Forest have been playing well of late. Have to win on Saturday.

[Johnsie123]

Farke has established his credentials as a good manager.

Fans will always have doubts about any particular setup at their club.

Doubts are ok, I just believe that if you go looking for things to worry about you will find them and once you have your theory will then go looking for reasons to double down on them.

While doubts are part and parcel of being a fan, unfair criticism of things you have no real insight into is just foolish.

I read a fair bit of that on here and while it is sacrosanct because it is opinion, it doesn't mean it is in any way credible.

Has he won me over?
He didn't need to, his credentials as a manager were well established before he arrived.
He helped us promote albeit one season after we would have liked and that has meant we lost Rutter etc.

Does that mean I believed he would keep us up?

I didn't, but not because of Farkes ability I didn't think we had enough tools in the box to do the job pre season.


Truth be told he has become a massive positive influence on the club and if he is given the right tools could help Leeds avoid becoming a yoyo club in the future.

I am one of them ,I am not convinced he is a good premiership manager but he is a very positive person within the team and makes them positive.
I think he will keep his job at the end of season so long as he keeps us up ,but I still think a lot depends on how we start next season because as we all know to well the 2nd season is tough ,being a devil's advocate there are going to be a few managers moving around at the end of season .

[Irish Ian]

I am one of them ,I am not convinced he is a good premiership manager but he is a very positive person within the team and makes them positive.
I think he will keep his job at the end of season so long as he keeps us up ,but I still think a lot depends on how we start next season because as we all know to well the 2nd season is tough ,being a devil's advocate there are going to be a few managers moving around at the end of season .

Out of interest who do consider to be a good PL manager?

Or simply put out of the current 20 would you consider to be a better than our manager?

Genuine question.

[ruttermania]

Talking to a few Irish Spurs fans over the last few days and there is a total sense of doom and gloom about them and a fatalism which appears to mirror that of the playing squad bar their one bright spark Archie. While we would all have loved to achieve promotion the first season after relegation it is most important to remember the state of the club in July / August 2023 and to give due credit to DF for stabilising and re-energising the entire set up when there was a real risk of a total implosion . It should be remembered that in that season we got 90 points and beat both Leicester and Ipswich home and away and we were really hamstrung by a poor star largely because of the relegation clauses etc. Last season was a triumph and this season we have defied expectations and smashed tired old records so I'm strongly of the belief that if it ain't broke don't try to fix it . We need to use stability and consistency to build over a three year period and develop a squad / set up that will give a basis for future success.

[Johnsie123]

Out of interest who do consider to be a good PL manager?

Or simply put out of the current 20 would you consider to be a better than our manager?

Genuine question.

Hurzeler,areola howe emery ,obviously pep,Arteta can't think his name palace manager.
I suppose if you have 100million + most can be decent managers I suppose.
As I say the 2nd season is harder than the 1st I guess cos they all know how you play that's why you have to evolve which is where I think he will fall down possible.

[1964white]

Talking to a few Irish Spurs fans over the last few days and there is a total sense of doom and gloom about them and a fatalism which appears to mirror that of the playing squad bar their one bright spark Archie. While we would all have loved to achieve promotion the first season after relegation it is most important to remember the state of the club in July / August 2023 and to give due credit to DF for stabilising and re-energising the entire set up when there was a real risk of a total implosion . It should be remembered that in that season we got 90 points and beat both Leicester and Ipswich home and away and we were really hamstrung by a poor star largely because of the relegation clauses etc. Last season was a triumph and this season we have defied expectations and smashed tired old records so I'm strongly of the belief that if it ain't broke don't try to fix it . We need to use stability and consistency to build over a three year period and develop a squad / set up that will give a basis for future success.

I honestly can't see Spurs picking up ten points in their final six games.