Summer 2022 transfer speculation and squad discussion

[1964white]

We've got away with murder this season with having Meslier and Klaesson as our two gks. Meslier has took a right peppering due to our vacant midfield and atrocious defending. Thankfully he's stayed fit, but he's also not blameless for some of our defensive lapses. That JWP free kick was good, but he was poorly positioned and should have saved it.

Basic errors in positioning, ball distribution, etc, have cost us plenty of goals, so I feel like we could do with a senior pro, not Kiko, to give Meslier and Klaesson some guidance and pass on their expertise.

Indeed James

I assume you've been busy mate, as we haven't seen much of you of late.

[1964white]

You can have a 25 man squad

Ours this season

1 - Meslier
2 - Klaesson
3 - Ayling
4 - Dallas
5 - Shackleton
6 - Cooper
7 - Firpo
8 - Llorente
9 - Koch
10 - Struijk
12 - Hjelde
13 - Cresswell
14 - Phillips
15 - Klich
16 - Forshaw
17 - Roberts
18 - Rodrigo
19 - Raphinha
20 - James
21 - Harrison
22 - Bamford
23 - Gelhardt
24 - Summerville
25 - Greenwood

Hardly short on depth unless you're a Gelhardt/Greenwood/Cresswell/Hjelde/Summerville hater

Still require more quality in certain positions.

Several of that squad have been distinctly average this season.

Some encouragement with our young players shining when called upon, although none of them have cemented a regular place yet, apart from Pascal who seems to have lost his good form of late.

[White Riot]

Indeed James

I assume you've been busy mate, as we haven't seen much of you of late.

Yeah, plenty of work and other stuff to sort out Leon, all good though.

Off this weekend, so will get to watch some of the footie.

I'm thrilled that Jesse has been able to pick our team up off the floor and get some good results, that were desperately needed.

Easter next weekend here in Bulgaria, which is always a big occasion here and I've got some days off to celebrate and enjoy the holiday.

Happy Easter to yourself and Jill, I hope she has fully recovered now?

[DDB220]

Let Kalvin go, there's every chance he'll be nothing now his master has left - and let the yank spend the dough.
Raph too, let him be gone, he's too good for us and will start to sulk when the teams not performing to his liking.
Klich too - be gone if we can get 2/3m for you, too old.
Cooper also, be gone if you're gonna have to defend, how much for Coops?
Patrick also, how much? fix him up like you're selling an old car before it breaks down again, 30m ? (chuckles to self)

That's just a few for starters...who we gonna keep ? Meslier ? Depends how much we'd get coz he's not that great, snatch their hands off if it's above 15m....Keep Firpo, Dallas, Ayling, Harrison, Koch, llorente, Rodrigo, Forshaw ?

Have a firesale or what, then start afresh?.....keep the youth? get them into Jessball?

kinhell, i'm getting excited writing this!.....HERE COMES THE SUMMER!!

If you believe Firpo is worth keeping and Meslier should be sold you know absolutely nothing about football. 15 million for Meslier - I thought you were just a wind up merchant but you are clearly clueless and you have a go at Orta for not being able to pick a player ?????

[The Subhuman]

Still require more quality in certain positions.

Several of that squad have been distinctly average this season.

Some encouragement with our young players shining when called upon, although none of them have cemented a regular place yet, apart from Pascal who seems to have lost his good form of late.

well duh! ... But second season back after 16 years in the s**t that's quite a transformation. At least 15 of those are mid table prem quality, 2 are top 8 quality. 2 are top 4 quality and we have a lot of quality kids thanks to Orta and Bielsa ...

Even if you spend 100M and keep all the players we have you can always argue for more quality,

If you don't rate Gelhardt and the likes then fair enough, cementing a place has nothing to do with their quality.. We're protecting them somewhat while using players with experienced heads and it's worked.. Challenge this season was to stay up. It probably will be next season. We're too new to the division for it to be otherwise

[White Riot]

Still require more quality in certain positions.

Several of that squad have been distinctly average this season.

Some encouragement with our young players shining when called upon, although none of them have cemented a regular place yet, apart from Pascal who seems to have lost his good form of late.

Yeah, we really should be looking to improve the quality and depth of this squad. Firpo, Roberts, Forshaw, Llorente and Klich can all go for me. Llorente has too many headless chicken moments for me.. The others just aren't good enough for this level.

We should have Drameh coming back, and we can possibly get Gelhardt, Bate, Cresswell, Summerville, Hjelde and Greenwood seeded into the first team.

I still expect Raphinha will leave this summer, but it would be awesome if we could at least hang onto him until after the World Cup to increase his value. If he wants to stay and be part of our progression then that would be brilliant. Raphinha and KP will be looking to see if the club are serious about progression this summer, rather than just talking about progressing.

Struijk and others have suffered a loss of confidence due to our woeful season, where performances and results have been continually poor. It doesn't take many poundings to knock the confidence of players, and it ain't just the players who are responsible for those performances and results.

[weasel]

You can have a 25 man squad

Ours this season

1 - Meslier
2 - Klaesson
3 - Ayling
4 - Dallas
5 - Shackleton
6 - Cooper
7 - Firpo
8 - Llorente
9 - Koch
10 - Struijk
12 - Hjelde
13 - Cresswell
14 - Phillips
15 - Klich
16 - Forshaw
17 - Roberts
18 - Rodrigo
19 - Raphinha
20 - James
21 - Harrison
22 - Bamford
23 - Gelhardt
24 - Summerville
25 - Greenwood

Hardly short on depth unless you're a Gelhardt/Greenwood/Cresswell/Hjelde/Summerville hater

Excellent post. The issues is not a small squad but the quality of back up in certain positions which has been shown up this season - namely KP and Bamford (and Cooper possibly to a lesser extent as we should have enough cover there). Starting with KP and Forshaw, Koch, Struyjk aren't anywhere near his level. Even in the championship our record without KP was abysmal. SImilarly up top with Bamford and we simply haven't come close to replicating the 17 goals we got from his position as well as not really being able to replicate his link up play and defenssive duties too. Elsewhere and with the possible exception of the keeper then the back up is reasonable, i.e 3 wingers for the 2 positions with Summerville as the 4th option - crazy how the one position we are best set up in terms of strength in depth is the one position where we haven't really suffered injuries. Full back and if we take Ayling and Firpo as starters then the back up of Dallas and Shackleton has generally been okay - probably the biggest question there is not strength in depth but whether Firpo is the best starter.

Going into midfield and the trouble is not so much the back up but whether the preferred starters are even good enough. KP is probably our only central player that would start for another premier league side.

So it really isn't squad depth but depth in certain positions and starting quality in certain positions.

[HarryofOz]

Of course, everything is about one's opinion, Harry.

One of the reasons we've won only eight games this season is because we are vulnerable when injuries occur.

Other teams use seasoned internationals or experienced PL players when making substitutions.

Also, we've often had to use our subs in the first half & in some cases all three subs by half-time, whilst the opposition are using their subs late in the game when fresh lags were required.

Manure : Matic/Sancho/Martial - Firpo/Costa/Roberts
Everton : Townsend/Delph - Shackleton/Roberts
Leicester : Maddison - Roberts
Man City : Ake/Fernandinho/Gundogan - Klich/Drameh/Gelhardt
Chelsea : Christensen/Lukaku/Hudson Odoi - Klich/Gelhardt/Cresswell
Arsenal : Smith-Rowe/Soares/Tavares - Summerville/Greenwood/McCarron
Liverpool : Henderson/Milner - Roberts/Shackleton
Villa : Chambers/Young - Forshaw
Everton : El Ghazi/Alli - Hjelde/Roberts
Leicester : Lookman/Iheanacho - Gelhardt/Roberts

When we remarkably equalised a two goal deficit v Scum, they counteracted with three subs Fred & Ellanga (scorers of their winning goals) plus Varane when we had nothing more to offer.

Also because of our small squad/injuries the likes of our admiral stalwarts Stuart Dallas & Luke Ayling rarely get a rest

You can't expect us to have the depth of talent that the likes of Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs and the two Manchester teams. Their wealth far outstrips ours and they haven't just returned to the Premier League of 16 years outside it. They've been building there squads in the top flight for decades.

As for the others, who would they be turning to if they were without the equivalent of Cooper, Phillips, and Bamford for most of the season and others for good parts of it as well. And they have all - especially Everton - had a lot longer to build their squads.

Of course we have to strengthen our squad but we have to be financially realistic about it and take into account that we do have a swathe of talented youngsters. Our greatest need is probably and creative goal-scoring attacking central midfielder who will probably come into the first team in place of Raphinha who I assume will be leaving,

For any other position there is no point in getting another depth player, if we get someone they have to be first choice material and they cost money.

Two or three players is all we need to give us the boost for next season because you can't spend money on the assumption that you will have lots of injuries. That is just not realistic.

[1964white]

Yeah, plenty of work and other stuff to sort out Leon, all good though.

Off this weekend, so will get to watch some of the footie.

I'm thrilled that Jesse has been able to pick our team up off the floor and get some good results, that were desperately needed.

Easter next weekend here in Bulgaria, which is always a big occasion here and I've got some days off to celebrate and enjoy the holiday.

Happy Easter to yourself and Jill, I hope she has fully recovered now?

Jill is doing well, more or less back to normal, she's been doing a lighter work schedule, a gradual build up as the weeks go back.

Happy Easter to you & your family, James,

[The Subhuman]

Excellent post. The issues is not a small squad but the quality of back up in certain positions which has been shown up this season - namely KP and Bamford (and Cooper possibly to a lesser extent as we should have enough cover there). Starting with KP and Forshaw, Koch, Struyjk aren't anywhere near his level. Even in the championship our record without KP was abysmal. SImilarly up top with Bamford and we simply haven't come close to replicating the 17 goals we got from his position as well as not really being able to replicate his link up play and defenssive duties too. Elsewhere and with the possible exception of the keeper then the back up is reasonable, i.e 3 wingers for the 2 positions with Summerville as the 4th option - crazy how the one position we are best set up in terms of strength in depth is the one position where we haven't really suffered injuries. Full back and if we take Ayling and Firpo as starters then the back up of Dallas and Shackleton has generally been okay - probably the biggest question there is not strength in depth but whether Firpo is the best starter.

Going into midfield and the trouble is not so much the back up but whether the preferred starters are even good enough. KP is probably our only central player that would start for another premier league side.

So it really isn't squad depth but depth in certain positions and starting quality in certain positions.

Agree re striker though I do think it was always MB's aim to turn James into an Owen (MB preferred to build his players himself not buy them off the shelf) in a couple of seasons.. It is very difficult and very expensive to buy a striker in the prem.. If your rich it's tough (Manure resorted to an old has been. City failed) If your bottom 8 then the best chance is 15-25M punts on unestablished high ceiling talents that could easily flop

Midfield I agree is where we had issues, Klich and Forshaw have performed manfully but they're running out of steam. Dallas, who's a mid table quality centre mid has spent too much time covering other positions. Again a skilled AMF would be 30M at the cheap end and a true 8 to play alongside Kalvin seemed to be out of our reach in both transfer windows.. Aaronson in Jan would have been great but Kalvin with 6 games left still hasn't started since his injury so a partnership developing would have been unlikely

I'd have fudged LB with Firpo/Struijk/Hjelde and McCarron and kept Dallas alongside whomever was playing 4 (and for me that should be Llorente, much better ball player than PS or RK, whos best position is right CB) God Berardi would have been perfect as a Phillips replacement, small, mobile, positionally great, beat much taller players in the air with regularity and could really pick a pass.

[1964white]

Excellent post. The issues is not a small squad but the quality of back up in certain positions which has been shown up this season - namely KP and Bamford (and Cooper possibly to a lesser extent as we should have enough cover there). Starting with KP and Forshaw, Koch, Struyjk aren't anywhere near his level. Even in the championship our record without KP was abysmal. SImilarly up top with Bamford and we simply haven't come close to replicating the 17 goals we got from his position as well as not really being able to replicate his link up play and defenssive duties too. Elsewhere and with the possible exception of the keeper then the back up is reasonable, i.e 3 wingers for the 2 positions with Summerville as the 4th option - crazy how the one position we are best set up in terms of strength in depth is the one position where we haven't really suffered injuries. Full back and if we take Ayling and Firpo as starters then the back up of Dallas and Shackleton has generally been okay - probably the biggest question there is not strength in depth but whether Firpo is the best starter.

Going into midfield and the trouble is not so much the back up but whether the preferred starters are even good enough. KP is probably our only central player that would start for another premier league side.

So it really isn't squad depth but depth in certain positions and starting quality in certain positions.

Fully agree, Weasel

[1964white]

You can't expect us to have the depth of talent that the likes of Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs and the two Manchester teams. Their wealth far outstrips ours and they haven't just returned to the Premier League of 16 years outside it. They've been building there squads in the top flight for decades.

As for the others, who would they be turning to if they were without the equivalent of Cooper, Phillips, and Bamford for most of the season and others for good parts of it as well. And they have all - especially Everton - had a lot longer to build their squads.

Of course we have to strengthen our squad but we have to be financially realistic about it and take into account that we do have a swathe of talented youngsters. Our greatest need is probably and creative goal-scoring attacking central midfielder who will probably come into the first team in place of Raphinha who I assume will be leaving,

For any other position there is no point in getting another depth player, if we get someone they have to be first choice material and they cost money.

Two or three players is all we need to give us the boost for next season because you can't spend money on the assumption that you will have lots of injuries. That is just not realistic.

I agree with much of your post, Harry.

However, we were always vulnerable going into this season with no adequate back-up in certain positions.

With our injuries record the writing was on the wall as Cooper, Llorente, Phillips, Rodrigo & Raphinha missed 60 of our games between them in the 2020/21 season. I won't include Koch's 21 games absence as I don't class him as high as the five I've mentioned. Fans forget we had an horrible injury list & we still managed to finish 9th, that PL position is probably one of the reasons for our complacency last summer!

We were fortunate Bamford escaped the injury hoodoo playing in all 38 PL games, oh how we have missed him, but we went without a proper back-up No.9 which would have been useful to bring on for Paddy when required

[1964white]

Agree re striker though I do think it was always MB's aim to turn James into an Owen (MB preferred to build his players himself not buy them off the shelf) in a couple of seasons.. It is very difficult and very expensive to buy a striker in the prem.. If your rich it's tough (Manure resorted to an old has been. City failed) If your bottom 8 then the best chance is 15-25M punts on unestablished high ceiling talents that could easily flop

Midfield I agree is where we had issues, Klich and Forshaw have performed manfully but they're running out of steam. Dallas, who's a mid table quality centre mid has spent too much time covering other positions. Again a skilled AMF would be 30M at the cheap end and a true 8 to play alongside Kalvin seemed to be out of our reach in both transfer windows.. Aaronson in Jan would have been great but Kalvin with 6 games left still hasn't started since his injury so a partnership developing would have been unlikely

I'd have fudged LB with Firpo/Struijk/Hjelde and McCarron and kept Dallas alongside whomever was playing 4 (and for me that should be Llorente, much better ball player than PS or RK, whos best position is right CB) God Berardi would have been perfect as a Phillips replacement, small, mobile, positionally great, beat much taller players in the air with regularity and could really pick a pass.

On hindsight we should have retained Berardi & Alioski who were costing us next to nothing in comparison to the out laying expenditure. Both knew what to expect in our system, I firmly believe we have missed then this season,

[HarryofOz]

I agree with much of your post, Harry.

However, we were always vulnerable going into this season with no adequate back-up in certain positions.

With our injuries record the writing was on the wall as Cooper, Llorente, Phillips, Rodrigo & Raphinha missed 60 of our games between them in the 2020/21 season. I won't include Koch's 21 games absence as I don't class him as high as the five I've mentioned. Fans forget we had an horrible injury list & we still managed to finish 9th, that PL position is probably one of the reasons for our complacency last summer!

We were fortunate Bamford escaped the injury hoodoo playing in all 38 PL games, oh how we have missed him, but we went without a proper back-up No.9 which would have been useful to bring on for Paddy when required

I think that the striker situation is the trickiest. I believe that Gelhardt is good enough. Our coaches have obviously seen something in his game that doesn't make him a starter yet as neither Bielsa or Marsch used him that way.

I think it depends on which way Marsch goes formation-wise. If he is going to play two upfront then we probably will need another striker. If we are going to play one man upfront, and that man is Bamford then we can call on Gelhardt, Greenwood off the bench (with the additional experience of having played this season) and then turn to the likes of Rodrigo, James and Roberts. If we play one upfront and buy a new striker either as a first choice or as the first choice replacement for Bamford, then where does that leave Gelhardt and Greenwood. The others I have listed can slot into other positions.

It's the same with centre-back where we have the likes of Koch, Llorente, Cooper, Struijk, Creswell and then Ayling or even Phillips. There is no point getting another 'depth' centre-back. If we get one then he must be a first choice player.

Central midfield/wingers is similar. We currently have Klich, Dallas, Robert, Rodrigo, Harrison, Raphinha (though he will likely go), Forshaw and James going for those spots. Not to mention the youngsters coming through. Again there is no point in getting another depth player for the role. Anyone we buy must be good eough to say. He is a starter ahead of the rest. Again that costs money.

Back-ups for Phillips - we have Forshaw, Dallas, Koch, Struik, Llorente and probably some youngsters as well. Is anyone better going to join us and be happy to be the back-up to Phillips all season. In all likelihood only playing if Phillips is injured.

The teams with money or those challenging for European spots (essentially the same teams) can attract quality internationals because they can pay them and they can even get the glory of success (medal)s as squad players. We are not in that position yet.

So in summary, I'd say two to three new signings will suffice but they should be first choices rather than depth players.

[1964white]

well duh! ... But second season back after 16 years in the s**t that's quite a transformation. At least 15 of those are mid table prem quality, 2 are top 8 quality. 2 are top 4 quality and we have a lot of quality kids thanks to Orta and Bielsa ...

Even if you spend 100M and keep all the players we have you can always argue for more quality,

If you don't rate Gelhardt and the likes then fair enough, cementing a place has nothing to do with their quality.. We're protecting them somewhat while using players with experienced heads and it's worked.. Challenge this season was to stay up. It probably will be next season. We're too new to the division for it to be otherwise

Yes I get where you're coming from Faaip.

I still think we wasted nearly £50 million of our expenditure last summer when we should have invested that money in other areas of the squad.

For me, it confirmed to me early doors when I witnessed our pre-season & then our lethargic start to the new campaign. then, injuries kicked in to key players, and we have never recovered from what has been a stop-start season,

I just hope we have learned our lessons in the future!

[SG90]

Back-ups for Phillips - we have Forshaw, Dallas, Koch, Struik, Llorente and probably some youngsters as well. Is anyone better going to join us and be happy to be the back-up to Phillips all season. In all likelihood only playing if Phillips is injured.

I'd rather mould Kenneh to be Kalvin 's deputy, than spend money on someone to sit on the bench. What happened to us promoting from within? Or do we not do that anymore?

[HarryofOz]

I'd rather mould Kenneh to be Kalvin 's deputy, than spend money on someone to sit on the bench. What happened to us promoting from within? Or do we not do that anymore?

That's fine by me. Not seen Kenneh play, but if we have the youngsters who can do the job that is definitely a better medium to long term tactic than simply spending money.

[SG90]

We need:
GK - then loan Klaesson out
RB
LB
CB
Aaronson
Box to box CM - maybe Nicolas Raskin? Or James McAtee from Man City
Striker
Winger - Noa Lang hopefully

I'd sell Raph (but only for top whack not £30m), Llorente, Bamford, Klich, Roberts.

Can't see us getting 8 players though. 1/2 signings isn't good enough.

[1964white]

I think that the striker situation is the trickiest. I believe that Gelhardt is good enough. Our coaches have obviously seen something in his game that doesn't make him a starter yet as neither Bielsa or Marsch used him that way.

I think it depends on which way Marsch goes formation-wise. If he is going to play two upfront then we probably will need another striker. If we are going to play one man upfront, and that man is Bamford then we can call on Gelhardt, Greenwood off the bench (with the additional experience of having played this season) and then turn to the likes of Rodrigo, James and Roberts. If we play one upfront and buy a new striker either as a first choice or as the first choice replacement for Bamford, then where does that leave Gelhardt and Greenwood. The others I have listed can slot into other positions.

It's the same with centre-back where we have the likes of Koch, Llorente, Cooper, Struijk, Creswell and then Ayling or even Phillips. There is no point getting another 'depth' centre-back. If we get one then he must be a first choice player.

Central midfield/wingers is similar. We currently have Klich, Dallas, Robert, Rodrigo, Harrison, Raphinha (though he will likely go), Forshaw and James going for those spots. Not to mention the youngsters coming through. Again there is no point in getting another depth player for the role. Anyone we buy must be good eough to say. He is a starter ahead of the rest. Again that costs money.

Back-ups for Phillips - we have Forshaw, Dallas, Koch, Struik, Llorente and probably some youngsters as well. Is anyone better going to join us and be happy to be the back-up to Phillips all season. In all likelihood only playing if Phillips is injured.

The teams with money or those challenging for European spots (essentially the same teams) can attract quality internationals because they can pay them and they can even get the glory of success (medal)s as squad players. We are not in that position yet.

So in summary, I'd say two to three new signings will suffice but they should be first choices rather than depth players.

Goalie (back-up)
LB
DM (back-up)
AM
Striker (back-up)

Are my concerns. If we are able to bolster up at least three of those positions, we should be in a better place next season.

[HarryofOz]

Goalie (back-up)
LB
DM (back-up)
AM
Striker (back-up)

Are my concerns. If we are able to bolster up at least three of those positions, we should be in a better place next season.

Fair enough.