The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

For everything Leeds United related and everything not - Have your say... the Marching on Together way!
Forum rules
Please be sure you are acquainted with the forum rules outlined within our FAQs.

Help support the site by using our Amazon Affiliate link when making any purchases from Amazon.
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

SaraM wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:36 am I was of a similar mind until the Bielsa sacking, and his replacement with Marsch. As succession planning goes, it looks completely botched.

It's not so much that I'm clinging onto Bielsa as I am clinging onto the expectation that we could/ should have progressed onto another, top level, innovative (probably European) coach.

The Marschification of Leeds is on Orta, and I'm still a long way from being convinced it's anything other than a dead end at best, or more likely a retrograde step from which it'll take a long time to recover.

I feel we've sold a bit of our soul in the process too, and that's probably the thing that hurts the most. Even if Marsch does well, we won't be the outliers in the Premier League anymore, sticking to our philosophy and our principles. I used to think Orta got that, but I've lost my faith in him.
Not another manager in the world with MB’s philosophy, honour and ethics. Almost certainly well on the spectrum I identify heavily with him. For me Marsch was about as good as we could have gotten and as ever I want us to succeed.
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

I never listen to JM’s pressers
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
Kennyb41
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
Posts: 10810
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2022 10:15 am

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Kennyb41 »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 10:25 am Excellent use of youth, the passion, and I'm not one of those that subscribes to the theory that the buys have been poor. I rate Rodrigo, Firpo, James, et al.... He also bought both Bielsa and Marsch here, along with Rads. I consider it a team btw, not a disparate group of individuals, this club is run by the board, manager and scout as a team.... Don't like Rodrigo, you can attach as much blame to Bielsa as you can Orta ...

We're just about to start season 6 under this FO, When it first arrived there was a 5 yr plan to get back to the top division, we beat that by 2 years, it's a complete success as it stands right now...

Now we're in the stabilize phase... and I have a lot of patience and I'm analytical.

I'm CJays antithesis. I love this club...
Good reply thanks.

I just don't see many fruits yet myself.

The biggest success to date has been Bert, and to me it's that simple. I'm not 100% Bert was Orta's idea but i'll grant you he went and got him with his silver tongue, and that's all i think he has, a smooth talking tongue, gift of the gab type.

In my eyes Bert did everything to get us up and i give no credit to anyone else apart from getting him to Elland Rd, i've read somewhere that Cellino was the one that wanted Bert here although i'm not 100% on that.

Up to now i'll give credit for Raph and Joffy and that's about it for the time being.

All the others - Klich KP etc in my eyes are 100% down to Bert, i'll grant Orta Klich at a push.

The one person i am ok with is Radz, he had a plan and we're here, but even that is ALL down to Bert in my eyes (after trying and failing with umpteen managers)

Time will now tell, and i'll be the first back on here with any roaring successes.

I see where you're coming from now, but i just don't get it or agree, here's to the future :beers: and hopefully this :pop:
Not dependent on Google, the www or 'stats' - Just a guy that puts his eyes to full use on the beautiful game :geek:

;@)
Cjay
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 28191
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:01 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Cjay »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:42 am Added quality players at needed position
We havent got 1 single fit left back at the club :duno:

Both our main strikers can't stay fit for 5 minutes with the manager expressly telling us that the main one pure and simply isn't fit.

Not sure your statement rings true.
Signed

King Cjay

Fountain of all knowledge and wisdom
Cjay
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 28191
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:01 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Cjay »

SG90 wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:40 am CJay's stats would last for about 30 mins :lol:
:)

I'd love to have a 30 minute chat with them.

Would need the MOTforum board members to help carry all my research :lol:
Signed

King Cjay

Fountain of all knowledge and wisdom
Cjay
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 28191
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:01 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Cjay »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 10:25 am
I'm CJays antithesis. I love this club...
:duno:

What you trying to say . . . :(
Signed

King Cjay

Fountain of all knowledge and wisdom
User avatar
Kennyb41
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
Posts: 10810
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2022 10:15 am

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Kennyb41 »

Faaip, i was looking at that team of 21's that played the other night v Naaaarch, it had Klich and Forshaw in it along with all Ortas buys, how do you think it would fair in the upcoming Barnsley game?

I think it would get trounced.
Not dependent on Google, the www or 'stats' - Just a guy that puts his eyes to full use on the beautiful game :geek:

;@)
User avatar
mentalcase
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7045
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2021 3:19 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by mentalcase »

I wonder if we struggle to communicate with other clubs like we personally struggle when we ring companies up, like when you want to ring your bank say,
Hello, please put in your DOB
Now what is the 3 letter of your special code ?
Now the 4th letter ?
Sorry, I didn't quite hear that, please repeat it
Now, what is your dogs first puppy called ?
I meant cat !!
What can I help you with today ?
Sorry, I missed that, please repeat
If you like you can use our mobile app, just go to www.I'm gettingpissedoffgoodandpropernow
Sorry, I didn't quite hear that !
Press 4 for further assistance
Did I help you today ?
You can rate our chat by pressing 1 after the conversation

Oh, your'e Victor Orta from Leeds Utd, hi Vic, the target you wanted has just been sold whilst you were in a queue, but we have a special player called firpo
OK I'll take him.
"Critics are men that watch a battle from a high place, then come down and shoot the survivors"
SG90
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 15804
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by SG90 »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:42 am Added quality players at needed position
Gambling on Bamford a) returning to fitness and b) scoring as many goals as 20/21.
User avatar
BGwhite
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 6571
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:02 am

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by BGwhite »

Irish Ian wrote:Jimmy can stay and fight his place.

I know they most on here like to gurn about just about everything and that this will be a tough season bedding in new players and trying to get the best from Heldje,Joffy,Greenwood etc but lets face it if the management took their advice from MOT we would still be stuck in the championship....

Secondly and apologies on being blunt but the absolute lack of knowledge about the game is at times cringeworthy.

I don't think many could hold a conversation with the unholy trinity for longer than five minutes.
I'll fess up right now I'm not a church goer so you're absolutely right where I'm concerned.

Sent from my moto g(9) plus using Tapatalk

User avatar
andrewjohnsmith
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
Posts: 7854
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:58 pm
Location: California (Donny Born-n-Bred)

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by andrewjohnsmith »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 8:47 am I'd hate to see Cry go out on loan but at the same time I don't think he gets much game time. But you could also say the same for Gyabi, Gray, Hjelde, Drameh and Greenwood. Sending them all out on loan would leave us no depth but they're all too good for the 21's. Fernandez is also getting that way and I don't think it's long before we can say the same of Perkins ...
I really want to see Summerville break though into the 1st team. But it's hard to see with the signings we've made. Harrison and Sinisterra fill the left. Aaronson and James fill the right. He's a cracking prospect and I see him like Cresswell. A season on loan could see him establish himself as a 1st team starter.

It's a little clearer for the other young players: Gelhardt, Greenwood will get plenty of opportunities to play. Hjelde, Gtabi, Gray, Perkins are still at a level where they'll be happy proving themselves in the 21's, backing up the 1st team squad.

Summerville doesn't fall into those categories and I fear we'll be back in the same position as last January.

I didn't mention Drameh. He's similar. Ready for 1st team but 2 established RB's in front of him. He won't settle for 21's.
User avatar
1964white
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 127739
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:46 am
Twitter: @1964white

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by 1964white »

SG90 wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:40 am CJay's stats would last for about 30 mins :lol:
Sorry to laugh at SG's comment about you, Cjay.

:rol: :rol: :rol: :rol:
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

Cjay wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 12:07 pm We havent got 1 single fit left back at the club :duno:

Both our main strikers can't stay fit for 5 minutes with the manager expressly telling us that the main one pure and simply isn't fit.

Not sure your statement rings true.
Rome wasn't built in a day ... We'll be fine, stop panicking
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
weasel
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 14031
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 10:28 pm
Location: Within a mile of Yorkshire

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by weasel »

weasel wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:08 am A rare voice of sanity in a world obsessed with instant gratification. Were you born in Leeds?
faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:25 amNo
That's good as I like conversing with you and discussing things related to Leeds but apaprently, according to Lord Protector Chapelallman I am not allowed to talk to anyone born in Leeds about Leeds Utd.
CHAPELALLMAN wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 8:51 am And oh the irony of a guy from Whitby lecturing someone born and bred in Leeds.
Clearly you didn't feel like devoting your loyalties to Whitby Town FC then, but instead decided to adopt another club and then lecture Leeds folk on how to support their home football team...?
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

Cjay wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 12:09 pm :duno:

What you trying to say . . . :(
I like Rads - You don't
I like Orta - you don't
I'm Kinnear ambivalent, you have stronger feelings
I like all the players - you like 2 or 3
I'm ok with the Niners on board, you're not


etc

.
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
Irish Ian
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
Posts: 12934
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:53 pm
Location: Directly above the centre of the Earth.

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by Irish Ian »

SG90 wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:40 am CJay's stats would last for about 30 mins :lol:
:lol:
'
"Football is about the people and the players,” he said. “Then there are those who will mingle in the middle: the coaches, executives and journalists. That last group represents the worst part about football" Marcelo Bielsa
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

SG90 wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 12:46 pm Gambling on Bamford a) returning to fitness and b) scoring as many goals as 20/21.
Bamford is a 15 per season player, actually this is the best I've seen him play for us tbh on limited time.. Something has been added to his game
Rodrigo will get us 15 plus in a full season as forward
Gelhardt probably gets us 20 if he plays all 38 from the start
James would score around 10 I reckon playing forward for 38 games with the upside being higher

Then there's Fernandez and Perkins, both already too good for the 21's

I think Aaronson/Harrison are double digit scorers potentially, Sinisterra has a high ceiling but we've not seen enough
I think we'll get more from our defenders because we now look dangerous from set pieces
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

weasel wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 1:01 pm That's good as I like conversing with you and discussing things related to Leeds but apaprently, according to Lord Protector Chapelallman I am not allowed to talk to anyone born in Leeds about Leeds Utd.
lol.... I have him on ignore and if you do that now you can't even click on un hide reply
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
User avatar
mentalcase
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7045
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2021 3:19 pm

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by mentalcase »

faaip wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 1:13 pm Bamford is a 15 per season player, actually this is the best I've seen him play for us tbh on limited time.. Something has been added to his game
Rodrigo will get us 15 plus in a full season as forward
Gelhardt probably gets us 20 if he plays all 38 from the start
James would score around 10 I reckon playing forward for 38 games with the upside being higher


Then there's Fernandez and Perkins, both already too good for the 21's

I think Aaronson/Harrison are double digit scorers potentially, Sinisterra has a high ceiling but we've not seen enough
I think we'll get more from our defenders because we now look dangerous from set pieces
So, if we start with these players (providing they're fit) according to you we'll bang in 60 plus goals, then whatever the others add :duno:
"Critics are men that watch a battle from a high place, then come down and shoot the survivors"
User avatar
The Subhuman
Superstar
Superstar
Posts: 55526
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:03 am
Location: God's own county

Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 16th August) - Leeds trust the current first team squad to be successful

Post by The Subhuman »

mentalcase wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 2:08 pm So, if we start with these players (providing they're fit) according to you we'll bang in 60 plus goals, then whatever the others add :duno:
Nope, because they all won't start every game as forward .... or we'd have 15 players on the pitch
"Never debate an idiot, they'll only drag you down to their level and they have the advantage of experience"
Post Reply