Kiko Casilla

[Dietkebab]

This won’t be a popular opinion but if found guilty I believe Leeds should fire him.

The club should condemn his actions and take the most extreme disciplinary action possible which I guess this could come under gross misconduct or bringing the club into disrepute.

He has come good but as a club we have to show we won’t stand for it in any way at all.

[Irish Ian]

Been thinking about this s lot.

To be fair until society is prepared to have proper discussion about racism and what constitutes it organisations like the FA will struggle to come to grips with players who fall foul of those who are deemed to be guilty of it.

[rich_leeds64]

If guilty then he has to be punished but why is he looking at 8-12 games this is totally out of line with previous cases and not forgetting the £10K fine for Millwall and the £65k for Bulgaria. Complete inconsistency from the authorities

[Velotrax]

If guilty then he has to be punished but why is he looking at 8-12 games this is totally out of line with previous cases and not forgetting the £10K fine for Millwall and the £65k for Bulgaria. Complete inconsistency from the authorities

It's Leeds, EFL etc, why bring this to the fore before a crucial game?? thats pretty obvious, like spygate etc, all manipulated to attempt to derail us ...if Kiko, is guilty it would have been sorted weeks ago, but maybe the cleaner who was working in a bar close to the ground over heard her brothers daughter saying her best friends sister told her father that it's true?

[lufc1304]

Excellent analysis, Sara

Also, it's the Daily Heil, wouldn't believe a word that rag publishes. I'm not saying it isn't true, but I'll take it with a pinch of salt until I see it reported from a more reliable source

[SG90]

I have two thoughts on it. 1. Why have the Daily Fail been told before the club have? 2. If false, I hope we take legal action against them and sue for huge damages.

[Cjay]

From Twitter, so may be rubbish, but it's thought he used the word 'negrito', which doesn't have negative connotations in Spanish. He could have been saying something like, 'mark the black lad'. Using race as a descriptor isn't necessarily racist, the police do it all the time - although, of course, they are institutionally racist and ACAB! So, not necessarily intended as abuse, but lost in translation and could easily be misinterpreted.

Racism is endemic in society, and is a fallout from our colonial past. Until we move beyond the power structures left behind by imperialism, such inequalities will always be a problem. Much easier to castigate a Spanish goalkeeper for his use of language though... especially if he plays for Leeds.

It also seems the Daily Fail are claiming he has already been found guilty; a divisive and unsubstantiated story about Leeds, released on a matchday...

Very well put

I did wonder if it was possible he said something in Spanish that may have been usual for him but may sound racist here.

I dont believe Kiko is a racist i really dont.

He used to sit next to Marcelo at Madrid and Marcelo spoke about how he missed having him their. I know just because he sat next to a black player it doesnt mean he isnt racist but he seemed very popular at Madrid and us, i dont think he is that sort of person.

At worst i think something is lost in translation

[leedsmad]

From Twitter, so may be rubbish, but it's thought he used the word 'negrito', which doesn't have negative connotations in Spanish. He could have been saying something like, 'mark the black lad'. Using race as a descriptor isn't necessarily racist, the police do it all the time - although, of course, they are institutionally racist and ACAB! So, not necessarily intended as abuse, but lost in translation and could easily be misinterpreted.

Racism is endemic in society, and is a fallout from our colonial past. Until we move beyond the power structures left behind by imperialism, such inequalities will always be a problem. Much easier to castigate a Spanish goalkeeper for his use of language though... especially if he plays for Leeds.

It also seems the Daily Fail are claiming he has already been found guilty; a divisive and unsubstantiated story about Leeds, released on a matchday...

Sarah you are 100% correct .
I am Uruguayan was born there and lived there 6 years and the term "Negro" is used all the time if your mate is a darker colour .

Believe it or not it's not offensive gesture in Spanish it's the opposite , it's how close you regard them to you....I know it's sounds weird but trust me it's in our Culture.
I have a close mate who he goes by"Negro" and not by his first name Paul "Che que haces Negro" is a common thing you'll hear in South America and I'm not bullshitting you guys either.

[Irish Ian]

Personally I think Kiko will be found guilty, but I would hope Leeds would kick up plenty of dust if he does.

As the FA has either leaked the story officially or not it is an attempt to unsettle a fellow professional.
IE. Unsporting conduct.

[rab_rant]

Depending on where you live, and to which culture you belong to, and which language you speak
a word can have many connotations. Depending on which decade you lived the acceptable adjective
could have been black, (Black Panthers) coloured (White PC liberals) Afro American (Malcom X)

Much like the use of gender pronouns I suppose every "person of colour" would like to be referred
to with a specific adjective that they associate with and if you don't use the correct one then you could be classified as racist.

"Negroid" has traditionally been used within physical anthropology to denote one of the three
purported races of humankind, alongside Caucasoid and Mongoloid... and perhaps only Caucasoid
is viewed in a neutral light whereas the other two are deemed derogatory.

WIkipedia seems to say that in Spanish culture the word "Negro" (why do I have to use quotation marks)
only rarely has negative connotations. It makes an interesting read and I hope the FA realise that what
they are investigating is a clash of cultures and I hope they are not confused by the semantics of the case.

I wonder if the fungus Aspergillus niger would object to being called that if it had a voice?

Wikipedia Spanish use for the word Negro

[Irish Ian]

I wonder if the fungus Aspergillus niger would object to being called that if it had a voice?

Wikipedia Spanish use for the word Negro

That would depend on

1. If the fungus that spoke to it used the 'ge' sound
2. If the fungus that spoke to it was from the same sub type.

Please don't ban me.

[hector]

That would depend on

1. If the fungus that spoke to it used the 'ge' sound
2. If the fungus that spoke to it was from the same sub type.

Please don't ban me.

As the forum hatchet man, I can assure you that you are safe...... for now

I have tried my best, but I cannot ban you for being an anorak

[rab_rant]

A more important consideration than language itself is the relative power relationship between majority and minority demographics. Who gets to choose the terminology applied to particular groups, the people in those groups themselves, or the dominant race/ class/ gender in that population?

There is a some discongruity attached to minority groups using certain words to
describe certain ethnic groups. In the black rap culture the singers themselves
and their fans will often use the "N" word to refer to each other. There is no
condemnation associated with the use of the word. However if a white person
uses the word then immediately it becomes racist.

So it appears that when the minority uses the word it is acceptable yet when the majority
uses it then it is prejudicial. You would think that a word would be neutral but apparently not.

Life should not be a semantic minefield where we have to tread very carefully for fear of
the use of words.

[rab_rant]

It's not a discongruity at all, because the contexts are entirely different.
On the one hand, an oppressed race reclaiming a derogatory word as a stand against disempowerment, on the other, the dominant race refusing to stop using a word born out of white supremacism.
You're surely not suggesting those two usages are equivalent?

Words should be neutral and not be acceptable or unacceptable depending on who is
saying them.

I do not see how the use of a derogatory word empowers you. I would say it reinforces
the stereotype. If you don't want others to use it then don't use it yourself.

Rab "Whitey" Rant

[BobHirst]

I think that the "N" word has become a weapon for black people to show that only they have the power to use it.
In the scenario already mentioned by Sarah, I am totally dejected that Kiko is not allowed to say "someone cover the black guy". How on earth is that racist?

[rab_rant]

You cannot simply erase a history of colonialism, slavery and torture by declaring that, in your opinion, the word should be neutral.
Sara "Whitey" M

May I ask then are black people trying to assert power over white people by using the word Whitey.
I don't think I would take umbrage at being called Whitey. Words are just words.

There are somethings that I find hard to comprehend such as black people criticizing "Black lives matter"
If a individual feels oppressed he can say that the root cause has a historical background, That is the easy way out.
But some black people reject that completely saying by taking that route you are just reinforcing a victim
mentality. They would say that under the law slavery was done away with after the civil war and segregation disappeared in the 1960's and under the constitution all men are created equal and can pursue life liberty and happiness and those are the principles that are worth fighting for. The law gives dignity whereas history denies
it. You have to choose what you want to live under. If you act like a victim you will be treated like a victim.

There is a movie portraying the life of Lenny Bruce. It stars Dustin Hoffman and he explores the use
of words in which he says that if JFK continually used the "N" word then it would be less likely to upset
people. I don't think this is true and if any politician these days does "blackface" then the media
is immediately down on them like a ton of bricks. Justin Trudeau for example. This year he is being more
careful at Halloween.

As Lenny Bruce said "It is the suppression of the word that gives it power"
Don't watch this if you are easily offended

[rab_rant]

Even if you could render the word meaningless, as Lenny Bruce suggests, that wouldn't remove the discrimination behind it. You are still far more likely to be stopped, arrested, killed, by the police if you are black. You still cannot walk down the street without receiving abuse, you are still less likely to get the job, the house, whatever.

Stats show that black men are more likely to be killed by other black men than by the police.
Spike Lee Jones (a black man) made the movie Chi Raq saying homicide death toll in Chicago
surpasses the death toll of special forces in Iraq.
Black on black violence... does whitey still get blamed for that?
Black people on youtube are saying there needs to be a solution to gang violence
and when they speak up about it other blacks call them Jim Crow.
Seems you can't criticize your own race and have to toe the party line of slavery and oppression.
It is complicated and nothing to do with KIKO so I rest my case and say no more.

[Cjay]

KIKO CHARGED

FA Statement

Kiko Casilla has been charged with a breach of FA Rule E3. 

It is alleged that, contrary to Rule E3(1), the Leeds United goalkeeper used abusive and/or insulting words towards a Charlton Athletic player during an EFL Championship fixture on 28 September 2019. 

It is further alleged that the words constitute an “Aggravated Breach”, which is defined in Rule E3(2), as they made reference to race and/or colour and/or ethnic origin.  

Kiko Casilla has until 12 November 2019 to provide a response. 

CLUB STATEMENT

Statement.

Leeds United Football Club acknowledges the charge from the FA today relating to Kiko Casilla and an alleged breach of FA Rule E3 during our Sky Bet Championship match with Charlton Athletic at The Valley in September.

Kiko strenuously denies the allegation and has proactively worked with the FA during their investigation to date.

The next step of this process will be a personal hearing, in the meantime Kiko will remain available for selection.

[BGwhite]

Writings on the wall now I fear

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

[Irish Ian]

MENE, MENE, TEKEL and PARSIN.

God has numbered the days of your kingdom and has brought it to an end.

Think that might apply to our promotion chances if a big ban comes Kikos' way.