Marcelo Bielsa

[The Subhuman]

We're Brighton last season, this season, good team, one of the best in division last season but well down the table due to massive doses of bad luck so no surprise to see them perform well this

Were 1.75 seasons back after a long time in the wilderness, that's a 4 yr minimum rebuild... Can't think of many teams that could have achieved what we have, actually probably no team could given covid as well..

That's 16 years away from the money. Villa, Brighton, Southampton etc have a massive advantage in terms of preparedness. We're years away from competing with the power 5/6.

If we can hang on, and I'm not sweating yet not even close, then we will be 6-12 next season.

The fans are impatient, this is a process (I recall it was a 5 yr plan just to get back into the prem I think that is the end of this season) and if we stay up (we will) it all resets and a new season brings new fortune, new players, new hope. Nothing from the previous season matters or counts

I think MB stays if he feels appreciated but all the armchair wannabees may make a difference. You know waht will happen if we do let him leave, we'll get a manager not on the list of most fans because that's life. The odds of a successful manager after a very successful mamanger are small anyway. Manure still looking to replace Sir Alex, Arsenal haven't replaced Wenger, Spurs haven't replaced Poch...and so on

Moyes was a very good manager at Everton, completely s**t at Manure, very good again at West Ham. We could steal Pep from City and still fail if the fit isn't right. We know the fit is right with MB, lets keep him ass long as he wants

By the way anyone voting yes to going because they feel he'll go anyway needs to revisit their vote. That's not the question asked, so the poll results are corrupt

[CHAPELALLMAN]

Thanks, Kenny, but only on Monday I was described as 'wifey fingers', and 'one of the most disruptive posters on here', so I doubt there'll be a fan club forming any time soon!

I think those of us who love Bielsa are probably idealists, and want to see the game played in the style of total football, described in Chappel's post above. It probably comes down to how much stomach you've got for the inevitable implosions on the pitch when it doesn't work, and how pragmatic you want to be to guard against that.

I'm firmly in the attack is the best form of defence camp, and believe Bielsa's style is so good when it works, which it mostly has so far, that the high risk, high gain strategy is justified. Whether it can prevail in the premier league against superior opposition hasn't really been fully tested yet, and won't be unless we recruit well in the summer and give Bielsa another season to develop it further.

I think it can work, and is well worth the attempt. In saying that I'm also prepared to take the risks and consequences of being wrong, over the certainties of ditching it all to become one of the PLs pragmatic survivors, like Burnley. That's the ultimate question for the Bielsa rejectors to answer; what do you want instead? How else do you see Leeds competing in the top half against wealthier clubs? Or are you content to play dour, defensive football, scrapping for survival every year?

I think I'm half idealist, half pragmatist !

[Cjay]

I'll rephrase my original question; who do you see in the Premier League now who have the balance right, according to your expectations? Who would you rather be?

Of teams this season?

I'd say Southampton have a nice balance stylistically. They are actually probably an interesting glimpse into our future with the sell to buy attitude, perennial midtablers at best but the style is good.

But I'd actually say this season Brighton.

They average more possession than even we do but they also have the joint 5th best defence, same last season they had the 7th best.

That shows that they are well organised but also play good possession based football.

Only lost 5 this season ,only the top 3 have lost fewer.

Problem they have is player quality, they can't turn their good play into goals (5th worst attack).

So not a case of rather be but stylistically I think Brighton and to a lesser extent Southampton have a better balance than we do only hindered by player quality.

[CHAPELALLMAN]

Well researched and well made points.

It's quite sad when you think about it.

Football has never seen BielsaBall at its best because Bielsa has never been at a club that could provide the ideal players.

Closest we got probably Is when he was strongly considered by Barcelona to replace Pep.

A real what if scenario.

Thanks Cjay.

Yes, the acid test would have been a club with huge resources to see whether that Dutch system could realise its full potential according to Bielsa's vision.

[danhirons]

Unlimited funds for Marcelo would be as close as he could get to the 'robots' he's often said would win every game. Can you imagine Bielsaball funded by City's owners, for example, would be mouthwatering!!

We could have de bruyne on the bench and bielsa would still bring on Tyler Roberts before him!

[Clacton White]

I was gutted when Grayson was sacked and angered when Colin was appointed. Never hated a manager as much as him.

Its a massive "if" but I could hate Lampard more if appointed , but the club would not be that stupid , would they ? Actually I do hate him more now .

[weasel]

While it is a good article by Chapelallman it fails to answer the main question. This would be -

Would the group of players that are 'failing' due to playing in a total football formation and style actually be doing any better in any other formation? Not in an individual game but over the course of a season.

I would suggest they wouldn't. Totally agree that to win trophies you need to increase on the standard but that is true no matter what formation you play.

An interesting view would be Keegan's 'entertainers' and the view became that you couldn't win anything playing that way. If they'd have been more pragmatic etc. They scored plenty and conceded plenty but the style of play wasn't the reason they didn't win the title (and would they really have done better if they'd tried to play differently). Swop Shaka Hislop for Peter Schmeichel and they'd have won the title by a few points.

So for me Bielsa is overachieving - the ceiling of what he can achieve depends on what players he has, but that basically goes for every club.

[CHAPELALLMAN]

We're Brighton last season, this season, good team, one of the best in division last season but well down the table due to massive doses of bad luck so no surprise to see them perform well this

Were 1.75 seasons back after a long time in the wilderness, that's a 4 yr minimum rebuild... Can't think of many teams that could have achieved what we have, actually probably no team could given covid as well..

That's 16 years away from the money. Villa, Brighton, Southampton etc have a massive advantage in terms of preparedness. We're years away from competing with the power 5/6.

If we can hang on, and I'm not sweating yet not even close, then we will be 6-12 next season.

The fans are impatient, this is a process (I recall it was a 5 yr plan just to get back into the prem I think that is the end of this season) and if we stay up (we will) it all resets and a new season brings new fortune, new players, new hope. Nothing from the previous season matters or counts

I think MB stays if he feels appreciated but all the armchair wannabees may make a difference. You know waht will happen if we do let him leave, we'll get a manager not on the list of most fans because that's life. The odds of a successful manager after a very successful mamanger are small anyway. Manure still looking to replace Sir Alex, Arsenal haven't replaced Wenger, Spurs haven't replaced Poch...and so on

Moyes was a very good manager at Everton, completely s**t at Manure, very good again at West Ham. We could steal Pep from City and still fail if the fit isn't right. We know the fit is right with MB, lets keep him ass long as he wants

By the way anyone voting yes to going because they feel he'll go anyway needs to revisit their vote. That's not the question asked, so the poll results are corrupt

Some of those ' armchair wannabees' were born in the city and were supporting the club many decades before MB arrived at LUFC.

Comments like that just hack me off because some people just can't make their point without the heavy sarcasm. ' Armchair wanabees ' don't get paid £8m a year for following their club either. So it's a crass comment.

[Byebyegeegee]

Yes, indeed Sara.

I know you were asked a direct question Cjay but hopefully you are only comparing us to the likes of Brighton and Southampton and seeing them as models in the short term and not in the long term as, to me, that would mean we are limiting our ambitions and are looking to accept mid-table obscurity (as tempting as that would be at this moment in time).

Whilst, recently, they have been in this division longer than us and currently look reasonably assured of Premier League football, I can’t see either of them getting into the European places anytime soon. With all due respect surely, with our size, level of support and our history and achievements over the last 60 years, we should have the potential to be far more successful than both those clubs and, indeed, most of the other teams in the league or am I living in the past or in cloud cuckoo land?

[Cjay]

We're Brighton last season, this season, good team, one of the best in division last season but well down the table due to massive doses of bad luck so no surprise to see them perform well this

Were 1.75 seasons back after a long time in the wilderness, that's a 4 yr minimum rebuild... Can't think of many teams that could have achieved what we have, actually probably no team could given covid as well..

That's 16 years away from the money. Villa, Brighton, Southampton etc have a massive advantage in terms of preparedness. We're years away from competing with the power 5/6.

If we can hang on, and I'm not sweating yet not even close, then we will be 6-12 next season.

The fans are impatient, this is a process (I recall it was a 5 yr plan just to get back into the prem I think that is the end of this season) and if we stay up (we will) it all resets and a new season brings new fortune, new players, new hope. Nothing from the previous season matters or counts

I think MB stays if he feels appreciated but all the armchair wannabees may make a difference. You know waht will happen if we do let him leave, we'll get a manager not on the list of most fans because that's life. The odds of a successful manager after a very successful mamanger are small anyway. Manure still looking to replace Sir Alex, Arsenal haven't replaced Wenger, Spurs haven't replaced Poch...and so on

Moyes was a very good manager at Everton, completely s**t at Manure, very good again at West Ham. We could steal Pep from City and still fail if the fit isn't right. We know the fit is right with MB, lets keep him ass long as he wants

By the way anyone voting yes to going because they feel he'll go anyway needs to revisit their vote. That's not the question asked, so the poll results are corrupt

That in bold ruins the whole post for me, rude and disrespectful and lacking self awareness. Are you yourself not an armchair wannabe given you have an opinion to? Or does that only apply to people who you don't agree with?

Poll results are fine as I sincerely doubt anyone voting based their entire vote on whether they feel Bielsa will go anyway same as I doubt anyone voting the way they did purely based on the Everton result.

The rest of the post is your opinion which you are entitled to.

[Cjay]

Fair enough, but our aim is to be more ambitious than both of those clubs.

Brighton owner has put in far more money than ours and has spoken of Europe as an aim so not sure we do.

As it stands it is just words from him as much as us.

[The Subhuman]

That in bold ruins the whole post for me, rude and disrespectful and lacking self awareness. Are you yourself not an armchair wannabe given you have an opinion to? Or does that only apply to people who you don't agree with?

Poll results are fine as I sincerely doubt anyone voting based their entire vote on whether they feel Bielsa will go anyway same as I doubt anyone voting the way they did purely based on the Everton result.

The rest of the post is your opinion which you are entitled to.

No. I'm not criticizing the set up, I'm not demanding new players come in, I'm not adding anything to the transfer thread regarding who that should be. Nor am I criticizing the line ups Marcelo sets even when I don't agree. Nor do I decry his substitutions, again even when I don't agree. I'm not a bloke on the internet micro managing the club.

[Kennyb41]

I can't be arsed reading everything atm as i've just come home pissed, i'll read tomorrow, especially yours Sara.

But i've just realised i could be reading cjay and sc60's comments, and i don't know who the fck they are from Adam.

They could ( and should) be binmen for all i know, and i'm taking it all in !......Against the Messiah !

I need to get a grip.

[Kennyb41]

Cjay Sc60, what line of work are you in ? then i can suss whether to take your comments serious or not.

[Cjay]

I need to get a grip.

[Overman]

I can't be arsed reading everything atm as i've just come home pissed, i'll read tomorrow, especially yours Sara.

But i've just realised i could be reading cjay and sc60's comments, and i don't know who the fck they are from Adam.

They could ( and should) be binmen for all i know, and i'm taking it all in !......Against the Messiah !

I need to get a grip.

Yep, best ease up on the alcopops then.

[Cjay]

No. I'm not criticizing the set up, I'm not demanding new players come in, I'm not adding anything to the transfer thread regarding who that should be. Nor am I criticizing the line ups Marcelo sets even when I don't agree. Nor do I decry his substitutions, again even when I don't agree. I'm not a bloke on the internet micro managing the club.

I see so it relates only to people you don't agree with.

[Overman]

We're Brighton last season, this season, good team, one of the best in division last season but well down the table due to massive doses of bad luck so no surprise to see them perform well this

Were 1.75 seasons back after a long time in the wilderness, that's a 4 yr minimum rebuild... Can't think of many teams that could have achieved what we have, actually probably no team could given covid as well..

That's 16 years away from the money. Villa, Brighton, Southampton etc have a massive advantage in terms of preparedness. We're years away from competing with the power 5/6.

If we can hang on, and I'm not sweating yet not even close, then we will be 6-12 next season.

The fans are impatient, this is a process (I recall it was a 5 yr plan just to get back into the prem I think that is the end of this season) and if we stay up (we will) it all resets and a new season brings new fortune, new players, new hope. Nothing from the previous season matters or counts

I think MB stays if he feels appreciated but all the armchair wannabees may make a difference. You know waht will happen if we do let him leave, we'll get a manager not on the list of most fans because that's life. The odds of a successful manager after a very successful mamanger are small anyway. Manure still looking to replace Sir Alex, Arsenal haven't replaced Wenger, Spurs haven't replaced Poch...and so on

Moyes was a very good manager at Everton, completely s**t at Manure, very good again at West Ham. We could steal Pep from City and still fail if the fit isn't right. We know the fit is right with MB, lets keep him ass long as he wants

By the way anyone voting yes to going because they feel he'll go anyway needs to revisit their vote. That's not the question asked, so the poll results are corrupt

You feel better now.

[Rook]

I don't understand this growing narrative that Radrizzani and the club as a whole 'lacks ambition'
We've spent money in both summer transfer windows and iirc we were one of the highest spenders of last seasons summer transfer window.
And we did so without making hardly any money from outgoing players. Out of the 16 players who left Leeds at the start of this season we only received fee's for 2 of them ( Oliver Casey to Blackpool and Rafa Mujica to Las Palmas ) and both were nominal fees.
The club has been as ambitious as they realistically could be given we're going up against a lot of clubs who were receiving Premier League tv money every year whilst we were stuck in league 1 and the Championship surviving on scraps.

[Kennyb41]

Yep, best ease up on the alcopops then.

I'm 57, and can only presume you know what they are.